Geauga Lake wood coasters listed for sale

Thursday, November 8, 2007 9:06 AM
Mr. Fetterman could correct me on this if I'm wrong, but I believe Knoebels was in the market for a coaster at the time. Because of the timing, the Lake Compounce Wildcat was a candidate for relocation and PTC was big on selling Knoebels the plans for the Miracle Strip Starliner so a new coaster could be built from them. Before Knoebels announced the plans for the Rocket, it was featured prominently in an issue of ACE's Roller Coaster! magazine- I'm not sure if that brought attention to the ride, or if plans were already made to move the ride and announced after the publication of the issue. Regardless, I don't think the idea was to preserve a coaster as much as it was to add a new major attraction to Knoebels without breaking the bank. I'm pretty sure the price of the Phoenix came to about $1 million, which was a lot cheaper than a new coaster would have cost at the time. It seems the preservation angle was flaunted later on as an additional perk.

To me, the main idea behind any kind of preservation effort is respect for the original ride. If the Dipper were to be rebuilt exactly as it were with new materials, I would consider that a preservation effort to some extent. Of course, if some original/existing material were to be used in the reconstruction, I think it would make it even more of a preservation effort. But that goes back to what I said in the beginning about preservation being more about what each individual sees as preservation. I consider SFA's Wild One to be a preservation effort but there are those that believe the addition of the new helix at the end of the ride and the later changes to the first drop and turnaround keep it from being a preservation effort. Looking at things that way, is the current Big Dipper still the original ride? Rebuilds aside, the original double dip was removed and the shape of the first camelback was altered, making the ride somewhat different that the one John Miller penned in 1925.

It seems it is universally accepted that wood coasters are going to go through changes as they age. Going back to Dorney's Thunderhawk that features no original wood, it is still regarded as a 1923 coaster. If material alone were the very thing that defines the age of a coaster, Thunderhawk would only be as old as the oldest piece of wood on the ride (which makes no sense, in addition to the fact that it's impossible to document the age of every piece of material on the ride). I suppose that the relocation of a wood coaster that winds up needing a lot of new wood is pretty much the same as replacing a lot of wood on a coaster staying in the same spot.

*** Edited 11/8/2007 2:09:31 PM UTC by Rob Ascough***

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Thursday, November 8, 2007 1:02 PM
I do not understand why Cedar Fair will not move The Villain to another park. It's a great ride, and what people forget is only the track is wooden. The structure is all steel, making a move quit feasible. Heck, I'll take the Villian over Mean Steak any day of the week. World's of Fun does not have a true out and back, and they have plenty of room as well. Is it a maintenance nightmare maybe?
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Thursday, November 8, 2007 2:49 PM
William/Thomas Riker? Which was relocated and which is the clone? ;)

Big Dipper belongs on the Santa Monica Pier. ;)

*** Edited 11/8/2007 10:30:50 PM UTC by boblogone***

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Thursday, November 8, 2007 3:55 PM

Martling said:
I do not understand why Cedar Fair will not move The Villain to another park.

That is certainly a good question. I'm sure it would require a lot of labor to disassemble, transport, and reassemble that steel at California's Great America. But it seems that not having to purchase new material would be a substantial savings. I find it hard to believe that building a new coaster from scratch would be more economical.

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Thursday, November 8, 2007 4:59 PM
Cost for the big dipper is $50,000 and doesn't include dismantling it, etc. He will have these up at the IAAPA show for sale next week.
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Thursday, November 8, 2007 6:06 PM
50 grand to buy, 2 million tops to move.

That coaster has to cost at least 4-5 mill new.

Chuck

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Thursday, November 8, 2007 6:08 PM
^^^^ Lol Boblogone. I'm looking forward to the new movie coming out Christmas 08.

^^^ I forget who, but someone said the cost of reloacting a coaster vs. buying new was about 50 cents on the dollar.

^^$50,000 was the original cost to build it, not it's current sale price.
*** Edited 11/8/2007 11:08:39 PM UTC by Jason Hammond***

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Thursday, November 8, 2007 6:09 PM
I just called him and it's $50,000 to buy it.
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Thursday, November 8, 2007 6:12 PM
any word on cost of Villain?
Chuck
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Thursday, November 8, 2007 6:56 PM
I didn't ask about it, I think I was pressing my luck just to get the quote on that one. The guy kept calling me sir even after asking my name lol. The amusement industry must be almost entirely male.
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Friday, November 9, 2007 8:07 AM
See Im having trouble believing the 50 grand price. The fact that M&V is handing this means they will be part of the dissasimbly process. I Wouldn't say they're over priced but M&V isn't cheap.

Chuck, just wondering if M&V being involved is a condition. Remember when a park said you can have the coaster, You just gotta supply your own crew and have 2 million in insurance to get it?

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Friday, November 9, 2007 8:45 AM
$50,000...

...plus shipping and handling. Some assembly required. ;)

*** Edited 11/9/2007 1:46:24 PM UTC by Brian Noble***

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Friday, November 9, 2007 9:07 AM
^^ I don't know all the details but I don't think purchasing the ride locks you into using M&V for the relocation. Of course, there are worse companies you could use for help with that sort of thing. Didn't M&V play a big role in the rebuilding of the Crystal Beach Comet? Look how great that turned out!
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Friday, November 9, 2007 9:12 AM
$50,000 really, thats it. That can't be right. So how much would dismantling and transport cost? Big Dipper totally belongs at Santa Monica Pier, but it would also be a great addition to Navy Pier in Chicago.
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Friday, November 9, 2007 9:25 AM
It makes sense when you consider the alternative- Cedar Fair having to demolish the ride and remove the remains. That costs a lot of money. By selling the ride for a paltry sum (or even giving it away), Cedar Fair already saves money. Besides, it's not like they're going to do anything else with it.
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Friday, November 9, 2007 10:18 AM
Scrappers would take villain away and wouldn't complain one bit. Theyd get a couple hundred grand for the steel.
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Friday, November 9, 2007 10:29 AM

Charles Nungester said:See Im having trouble believing the 50 grand price. The fact that M&V is handing this means they will be part of the dissasimbly process. I Wouldn't say they're over priced but M&V isn't cheap.

Chuck, just wondering if M&V being involved is a condition. Remember when a park said you can have the coaster, You just gotta supply your own crew and have 2 million in insurance to get it?


On Part 1, I think M&V would be willing to help with disassembly, but that would *in no way* be included in the 50K price.

Part 2....wasn't that Hercules?

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Friday, November 9, 2007 12:28 PM

Brian Noble said:
$50,000...

...plus shipping and handling. Some assembly required.

*** Edited 11/9/2007 1:46:24 PM UTC by Brian Noble***


Plus if you call within the next 10 minutes, we'l throw in a second coaster absolutely free! That's two coasters, the pasta cooker, the set of steak knives and a container of Oxy-Clean all for only $50,000! :)

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Friday, November 9, 2007 12:28 PM
No, That was Jack Rabbit at Clementon that demanded 2 million in insurance.

I never said M&V would be willing or not. Im saying it might be a condition that that you have to hire them. AT LEAST FOR dissasembly to get it.

Could be totally bunk but M&V carries their own insurance Im sure of that.

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Friday, November 9, 2007 2:00 PM
If M&V is being hired to remove the coaster, they undoubtedly have their own insurance.
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