Dragster shut down after riders injured by debris

Let’s just assume for a minute that retrofitting with the S&S technology is a possible option. Is the relationship with Cedar Fair and S&S/Arrow any better after the whole Vertigo fiasco? I just don't see that happening.*** This post was edited by JamesB 7/13/2004 1:21:05 PM ***

The sad thing is........I graduated high school with these two girls, not the guy. They are money hungry families and they will sue the park for all it's worth, I guarantee it. Not nice people at all.

I was hesitant to ride TTD before I finally did it. After reading about these injuries, even though they are minor my confidence in Intamin has hit an all time low. I don't think I would ride again.

It wouldn't keep me from the Point of course, but I think I will head to other rides for a while.

Clarkbar...if I got hit by flying metal while riding the fastest rollercoaster on the planet I would sue to. It isn't like these victims spilled hot coffee on their laps. If they were following all of the rules then the park had a duty of care to keep them safe and uninjured.*** This post was edited by wahoo skipper 7/13/2004 1:41:41 PM ***

Well frist off I don't think TTD will be in the part much longer. When I was little I heard talk of tring to fix The Bat at Kings Island. I am not sure if any one got hurt bad. When I was at the park last year a part came off of the launch system while I was in line. Then they put a green tarp over it to cover it up so no one would see it.

Well, the consensus seems to be that TTD has not had enough problems to be torn down. So, my question is this...When will it be enough? How many cables have to snap? How may regular break downs is enough? Please, fill me in.

The down time is not the issue so much as the injuries. The metal shavings were part of the excessive downtime last year. Apparently they didn't get the flying, hot, oily bugs worked out over the offseason. If the park wants to keep spending money replacing parts (or Intamin if that is the case) so be it.

But, I don't think Cedar Fair or Intamin can afford to have anyone else hurt on the ride. They better get if fixed but good before they think about reopening it or they will get a real feel for what a real PR nightmare is.

A few observations:

"When will it be enough?"

My cynical side comes in and wonders "if this ride would be in another park, would people be giving it the benefit of the doubt as they are now? Or would they be all yelling, TEAR IT DOWN!"

Four other accidents involving Intamin coasters and Rides (S:RoS, S:RoS, Perilous Plunge, Hydro) appear to be a combination of questionable design, operator error, and rider error (check those restraints yourself... know what you can and can not ride). This incident with flying shards of metal (and most of the other problems that I have read about) either points to a maintenance problem or a design flaw. There is no way you can pin this one on the ops or the riders. If this would have happened to another park chain's ride, the cry would be "IF they would maintain their rides better!!!!"

Also... someone mentioned about knowing when to replace the cable. How many times has the cable broken or there been a cable problem? How old is the ride? How much has it run? Seems like reliability / wear and tear may be a factor.

These are just my observations.

However, I remember some time ago it was asked "How high is too high... how fast is too fast." Look at the stats of this ride and I think we have our answer... too high and too fast, at least for today's technology.

There is a limit to what we can successfully build.

I think TTD had exceeded that limit. To much speed, for the ride not to tear itself apart, using the material we use today.

Somene mentioned X, but I think X has been running fairly consistently. At least that one has been solved.

SFlake, yes you are right. Remember the whole X era. You could not open the board without an X bash. Indeed TTD is lucky to call CP home, were the CP fans will protect it's name.

I don't think it is really a design flaw. I think in another year, TTD will prove, we just tried to go to fast, to high.

*** This post was edited by Markieb 7/13/2004 2:18:39 PM ***

I think you make some valid points.

Reminds me of a line from Jurassic Park.

"Yeah, but when the Pirates of the Carribbean breaks down the pirates don't EAT the tourists."

It is one thing for a ride to break down. It is another for the ride to cause injury.

SF Lake said

"There is no way you can pin this one on the ops or the riders. If this would have happened to another park chain's ride, the cry would be "IF they would maintain their rides better!!!!""

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Man you are reading my mind. That bugs me too. That was exactly what I was thinking when I read you post. If it were SF it would be maintainence, since it's Cedar, it's design flaw.

Just goes to show even the best parks, can build poorly designed coasters.

Every park has ups and downs, every park can make a mistake! I do give them credit for trying, just like I did SF's for X, some times things can be fixed, sometimes they can't.

Is that not what prototypes are all about. We lean from mistakes. Todays leason , dont build over 400 feet , or go over 100 miles.

Yes, and I know someone is about to say I am already condeming the coaster, give them time. They had the time already people. This is season 2 for this thing. Did we not read work was being done in the off season to make this more reliable. Just the day I went July 5th, It broke down 3 times I know of. They have to replace parts. It is tearing itself apart. It is too much stress on the parts. Sorry many of you will not likt it, but I got an opinion, and rarely do I make a judgement call like this. I am just very confident that at best, this coaster has one more season left. Tear it down? Dont know. Modify to maybe a lift hill and drop.... Possible. *** This post was edited by Markieb 7/13/2004 2:32:51 PM ***

How exactly do you propose to make a lift hill and a drop out of that thing? That track is designed and rated for one purpose, one layout. You cannot simply bend the track another way, put a chain down the middle and wind up with a full-circuit ride. It just doesn't work that way.

It is simply NOT cost effective to remove this ride. No way, no how. Even if it means running it sporadically for another year or so until they find a new cable system and launch sled, it's more cost effective to do that than to not only write off the $25 mil for the ride itself, but the millions that were put into relocating other rides, reconfiguring the midway, hiring a crew to demolish it, and the PR blow from losing the ride. No, it'll stay and one day it'll run right. You people wanna talk about giving CF more slack than SF, X is now running relatively reliably from a mechanical standpoint (the only real problems I've heard about are crew related) and that took 3 years. Come back this time in two years (because CP's season is about 1/2 the length of SFMMs) and talk to me about TTD having as much time as X to get into shape ...

Everybody is talking prototype. Well, it isn't. The prototype is operating at Knotts, Xcellerator.TTD is merely an streched out version of XLR8R. And yes maybe they have exceeded the limits of some of the components used in the launch. That is an engineering snafu, and if Intamin were smart they'd be burning the midnight oil to rectify the situation,pronto. Their credibility in the business is rapidly deteriorating.

I wonder if untill they come up with some sort of "super cable," they ruduced the train size. One less car maybe. Less weight, less strain on the cable. It may reduce downtime and actually increase overall capacity.

I remember that Cedar Point made a statement about adding "quality" rides (meaning rides that work) when they added TTD. This statement was made in reference to the downtime of the Magic Mt rides.

They are eating some crow now. Biggest, fastest, highest does not mean quality. Most quality coasters are much, much smaller..............it was all hype (speed and height, short ride) and appears to be beyond the reasonable mechanical limits.

What we also have to remember is that although Intamin may be currently in a lot of trouble with TTD not working 'well,' as soon as Intamin fixes this problem (and nothing bad happens after) and comes out with another prototype, there WILL be another buyer. My main question: I know B&M has never been a major innovator, when will they get onto the launching scene?

This sucks! I was planing on going to CP this week, and we had passes to ride TTD without waiting too! Well... I have been waiting forever to ride TTD, but now im not too sure if I want to ride it anymore... but knowing me... I probably will.

I don't remember that statement, super7. Do you mind backing that up?

No one is eating any crow. They still have the best uptime in the industry.

But not on their latest hyped attraction...

Wow , bend the current track into a lift. I had not thought of that! What a great idea! NOT

I was thinking more along the lines of sueing Intamin , to refabricate a new lift, tear out the launch track, and make it a standard lift and drop. Millennium Style! It would still hold the height record.

It is a protoype. The California version is not 420 feet, therfore, it is a prototype.

Impulsive said....

It is simply NOT cost effective to remove this ride. No way, no how.

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I bet that has been said before on other removed rides.

Time will tell, my guess is that is over in the current configuration. I think the speed must be reduced, and that can only mean a lift or removal. Your guess is as good as mine, so look back a year from now, and see who's right.