Disneyland introduces $400 line skipping pass

Parks need to make sure there is enough for non-riders to do to justify the admission price. My 72-year-old mom doesn't ride much, but she loves the shows and the train at Dollywood. That's one park she doesn't mind paying full price for year after year.

Compare that to Kings Island in the spring, when they have between zero and 2 shows. It's no fun for her.

Why do people (or whoever) think this will sell enough to impact average guests or LLMP users? This is halfway to a VIP tour and I’ve never had an issue with them. Even at the lowest price point, you’re doubling your ticket price…and that’s on a slow day at AK.

The_Orient_of_Express:

Of course they would never do this, but I’ve always wondered if parks should offer a reduced cost pass for people who don’t ride rides at all. Like senior citizens or people who just want to watch a show or hang outside and people watch.

You should swing by Knoebel's.....

I vaguely remember Kennywood doing something like this back in the day. I think you got a wristband if you payed the higher price to keep track of who could ride and who couldn't. Anybody recall that?

Sure. They had string and stamp for the POP guests but also had a general admission that was cheap if not free. I think it was cheap. Anyway, it allowed the entire family to come, riders and non-riders alike, and over the years (decades) everyone got quite used to it. So when the park changed their admission options to POP only, you shoulda heard the crying. People still complain about it and grandma is opting to stay home. (Or shelling out the money). I see that move not only as a way to boost profits but also as a way to keep people from using the park as a hangout for 5 bucks which would be viewed by some as a problem. I’d be willing to bet that those two spheres of unhappy people overlap considerably.

ApolloAndy:

Why do people (or whoever) think this will sell enough to impact average guests or LLMP users?

This is a fair point. I had not really thought about it before you said this, but the truth is that certain VIPs got front of line privileges going way, way back. Celebrities were escorted to the front just to help alleviate the hysteria that might take place if that person was in the general queue. Don't know if they will be made to pay since this is marketed at Deluxe Resort guests (but I assume a lot of those celebrities stayed in the deluxe resorts).

There are approximately 5,000 deluxe resort guest rooms on property. Let's say they average 3 guests per room (no idea if that is accurate). That's 15,000 guests. Do we think 25% of them will buy the pass? That's 3,750 guests. Divide that by 4 parks. That's 930 guests per park. Maybe that won't move the needle that much on your wait time for Tron. If those 930 guests pay, on average, $800 for this, that is an extra $3,000,000 in revenue per day. Not too shabby. 25% may be underestimating this, however.

Is deluxe a requirement for the pass? Because if not I’m sure there are plenty of people with the mindset of let me stay at the cheapest hotel and save my dollars for where it counts. I know that when I’m on a park trip I’m only in the room to sleep, don’t need any of the extras.

RCMAC:

So when the park changed their admission options to POP only, you shoulda heard the crying.

That's hilarious. My experience was the polar opposite. I've been to Disney (Magic Kingdom) twice, once at age 6 and again at 14. At 6 admission was either free or cheap (I don't recall exactly because I was 6), and rides required tickets. What I do remember is my dad's constant aggravation at having to figure out how many tickets were needed for our family of 5 for each ride. Our second visit in the late 80s after they went to POP admission, my dad was elated.

As an adult I think it makes sense, and the same goes for all the big theme parks that have a POP model, but I also see the appeal of places like Knoebels where anyone can get in for free. I never thought that model worked as well for the larger parks.

Millennium, I believe it is for Deluxe resort guests only in the trial period (though...assuming it is a hit, and they follow the money, I'm sure it will be expanded). Actually, Swan and Dolphin may be included so my numbers may be underestimated a bit.

RCMAC, I also remember the sting wristband, with a metal clip that was put on when you paid the ride admission. This was at Cedar Point in the early '70's. I also seem to remember a hand stamp that had the old Cedar Point logo.

Lists hotels for the WDW pass:

https://disneyworld.disney....PurchaseLL

I could see them keeping the lightning lane premier passes exclusive to the higher end resorts. Incentive to stay there.

I would be surprised if the large destination/regional parks offered non-riding passes. Adds something else to check. And everyone needs to get a wristband (or some other way to verify someone get a pass for rides). To add how many additional guests per day?

So, I am going to draw from RCT gameplay, as for some reason it tends to translate really well into actual park mechanics. I would imagine that the parks do not allow people in for near free or free because that adds a bunch of bodies to the pathways. I know in RCT the ride queues do an awesome job at soaking up bodies and getting them out of the way otherwise you get the "It's too crowded here" en masse. Would letting in non-riders make this play out in real life? I am confident that parks have analyzed this and that non riders would be a net negative, otherwise why wouldn't you want the food and merchandise revenue, and the small pittance they pay to walk through the gates.

I guess a park would have to test the free pass thing out for awhile. But how many peeps would use the free pass a day?

Would it be enough to degrade the paying customer guest experience? obviously a free guest would still use resources like walking space, restrooms, trash, etc.

but You would think that a free pass would still translate into revenue like drinks/food/games/souvenirs to offset that.

Bozman:
I also remember the sting wristband,

I had a little collection of my strings from various parks. The metal clasp usually had a park logo on it.
They used them for years at CP and as they had various admission levels it was necessary. Waaay back when CP was “new” they had general or free admission, and tickets. And the offers were good only for specific days of the week. Tickets could be used any day but POP was only on Tuesdays and Wednesdays or something like that. Monday and Thursday were A thru D ticket booklets just like Disney (who they were trying desperately to be). When they finally went to POP the strings and stamps remained and when I worked at the park in the 70’s the admission gate personnel included the actual job title of Stringer and Stamper- young ladies who did nothing but that all day long.
Angus Wynne who invented the OG Six Flags parks is also credited with the first POP concept. His idea was to have everyone pay the same to enter then not have to spend another dime while in the park. Nobody had it, not even Disneyland. It caused wary skepticism within the industry until they figured out it could actually be profitable. Through my life I’ve seen regional themers and amusement parks move away from tickets to POP with few exceptions. One of those, as our Vater points out, is our beloved Knoebels still stuck in the dark ages of free admission and a ticket booth in front of every ride. No POP on weekends. But it works, and I can’t imagine the uproar if they were ever to fence the place in and ask everyone for 50 bucks. I don’t know what Camden is doing now but when I was a small child I’d go there every summer with my grandparents and to get in we had to put a dime in a subway-like turnstile at the gate. Tickets were 5 cents apiece or something and the rides were like 4 for the Whip, 6 for the coaster, etc, but entry was only ten cents.
Sorry for the diversion, but there’s a little history lesson for the young’uns.

25% (which would still have small impact on lines) seems grossly overestimated. I would guess 25% of guests are using LLMP at literally 1/10th the price. Who is going to look at LLMP for $30 and decide LLPP at $300 is a good deal? I bet it’s really for international “once-in-a-lifetime” guests.

I would never consider paying that much in either US resort, but if I were going to Tokyo, Paris, or Shanghai I would definitely give it a look.

I hope I'm wrong about the percentage of users, and I may be. I'm just always amazed by how much they charge for Deluxe resorts, and their occupancy is always high.

I lived in Southern California during the Disneyland in the pre-POP years at Disneyland. I remember some pretty good fights about the last remaining E-ticket in the book. I also remember throwing out unused tickets at the end of the night. I sure wish I had kept some of those.

There seems to be no theoretical ceiling to how much certain people will pay to get that Disney drug.

That’s fair. I don’t know how people are staying at Grand Flo or Grand Cali.

I don't think the people spending that kind of money are drug addicts. They're "benefit oriented" consumers who can afford a better way. I don't but better seats on planes because I love flying. And I have done VIP at Disney. The reason is because I wanted my friends and family to have a good time together in a way that we felt taken care of.

The addicts are the ones complaining about this.

Exactly. I'm not ApolloAndy-level good at hacking the FP+ system, but I know my way around a few of the loopholes. It is feasible for me to get on pretty much everything with a minimal wait over the course of my trip. But, it means getting up early, hitting rope-drop, refreshing my phone, hitting drop times, etc. That's not a big deal, but if I throw several hundred dollars at it, I can sleep in, waltz into the park at 2PM, and do whatever I feel like doing.

Would I do that every day, or even once every trip? Probably not. But, it is on the "things I will do from time to time" list.

RCMAC:

Camden is doing now but when I was a small child I’d go there every summer with my grandparents...

I'm just a little younger than you. I don't remember putting the dime in the turnstyle, but I do remember it being ¢50 to enter, You'd pay the nice older ladies at the entrance. $4.50 would get you the string snapped tight with a metal clasp and a handstamp, which would allow you to ride all day. Or you could buy tickets to each ride.

After Thunderbolt Express opened, the park went to pop, and charged everyone $14 to enter, iirc.

Now it's $8 for parking, and about $25 per person to get in. People my age remember the handstamp and "bracelet" fondly.

The toilet stalls did take a dime though. I think that was to prevent people from doing sexytime in the restrooms.

I am sorry for the diversion as well.