Deja Vu - Two Down, One To Go?

Tuesday, November 13, 2007 6:32 PM
Yes, but it looks like IRM Rides has the lead, and the info on them. They are in IAAPA, booth 4636. FYI.
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Tuesday, November 13, 2007 7:14 PM
CPLady's avatar That 2.5 hour wait was in August of 2002 when it was only open 5 hours a day. And yes, the park was packed. I wasn't dreaming the 90 minutes *I* waited for it, nor the fact by the time it opened, the wait had increased to 2.5 hours.

I'd rather die living than live like I'm dead

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Wednesday, November 14, 2007 11:09 AM
Spinout is right--the average wait in the last few years has been 30 minutes to an hour. And the ride has been open almost daily.
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Wednesday, November 14, 2007 11:19 AM
matt.'s avatar

Jiggidy James said:
but the real coaster enthusiasts, like myself, will be thankful they either waited patiently for the ride or were brave enough to conquer it.

All the "real" coaster enthusiasts don't care about what other people think makes them a "real" (or fake?) enthusiast.

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Thursday, November 29, 2007 1:37 AM
matt. said:

All the "real" coaster enthusiasts don't care about what other people think makes them a "real" (or fake?) enthusiast.

What I'm saying is that Deja Vu was worth any trouble it might have put park guests through. Yes, it didn't have the best reputation as far as running goes, but it did have the impact to make people speak highly about it.

If you didn't ride Deja Vu, that doesn't mean you're not a coaster enthusiast. It means that if you only have so much time, and you won't be visiting often, you might not wait over an hour to ride.

I myself wouldn't wait if the queue was filled to capacity. But because I didn't have to wait that long, I consider myself fortunate.

I wouldn't consider spending a decent chunk of my day at SFGAm waiting for Deja Vu. If I was with someone who hadn't been there before, and might not go again because they used my free coupon, I would wait with them. Otherwise, I don't wait unreasonable amounts of time for one ride alone.

I just go about 20 times a Season, that's all. And I do care what people think, Matt, and I respect their opinions and only suggest mine to others to further expand our regions of thought. Thank you for your discussion.

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Thursday, November 29, 2007 10:30 AM
I'm also in the club of people who thinks that the VUs (I only ever rode the one at SFMM though) are a good rides -

* the massiveness and enormousness of the whole ride is great

* there are these curious moments when the train gets caught in each of the the towers that feels really crazy, like someone didn't think the ride through :)

* the relative smoothness of the ride.

The downsides are:

* waiting time, waiting time, waiting time...

* cobra roll (they should put an immelmann/diveloop on these things as a turnaround.)

* antisocial seat placement that separates riders from one another as opposed to encouraging a shared experience

* of course the downtimes (I was never effected by one though)

* more waiting time...


airtime for everyone
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Thursday, November 29, 2007 11:08 AM
I never really got the concept, and I'm a self-proclaimed Boomerang/Invertigo fan. Why is it that people generally hate those things but worship the Deja Vu coasters? The lift/lift mechanism is overly complex, the seating arrangement is absolutely idiotic and while it only matters from an aesthetic standpoint the things are hideous to look at. Give me an Invertigo over one of those!
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Thursday, November 29, 2007 1:18 PM
^The first question is why do they like Deja Vu, and not the boomerang. The two boomerangs I have been on are quite rough. They are jerky, and they will give you a beating. Deja Vu is not like that. It's smooth. I do like those boomerangs even though they do what they do, but they are just aren't as great as Deja Vu. I don't really know about the Invertigos. The towers on Deja Vu are 90 degrees compared to 45 maybe. I don't know. It's a huge difference.

I don't see how the lift mechanism is that complex for Deja Vu. It has a catchcar, and it uses cables to bring the train up to the top of the tower. I believe that the reason why an Invertigo doesn't need those wheels is because 90 degrees pushing up a train is quite heavy. 45 degrees is heavy, but it's not nearly as rough as 90. The wheels act like pulleys. I learned this in gym class awhile ago.

They attach something to a wheel in the air, and it will raise up with less stress. The more wheels, the less stress gets pushed on any individual one. That's why the ride has all those wheels.

I see two reasons for the "idiotic" seating. People are chicken, and people ride single. For the people that are more chicken of heights, they can ride in the A rows. I don't care for the A rows because of that fact. You have this metal thing in front of you in which you can't stretch your feet, and feel like you are falling out. I want that feeling.

For the other reason, you know on how many rides there are single riders. So, why not have single seats for them. I do however think the seats are placed too close together. They should be farther apart, but again, maybe they did that for the comfort of the A riders (except the first row). If they are placed the seats close together, than those riders won't be as scared to ride it.

As for the Invertigo's seating arrangement. I haven't been on them, but I think that those seats are just bad. I don't want to look at other people's faces while I'm riding the ride. I have no problem with the regular boomerang's seating as it is like an Arrow.

I don't think the train, or the rides looks ugly at all. I like the look of the train. So, I don't see the point, but oh well.

_____________________________________
Remember, I was talking about why the Invertigo's work, and Deja Vu doesn't work as much. I figured another reason that the two are different besides on is 90 degrees, and one is maybe 45. The Invertigo has brakes on at least the second tower.

Now, I'm not exactly sure how that ride works, but I'm guessing that the ride brakes, and than the catchcar moves to find where it's going, and than hooks up to the train. On Deja Vu, the catchcar is moving, and the train is also moving. It's a lot harder that way to catch the darn thing. You go why didn't they put brakes on Deja Vu. The tower is 90 degrees, and it's kind of hard to stop the ride in the middle of the air with brakes. They could have tried LIMs maybe. This would be like Mr. Freeze on the top of the tower, but stopping a little longer.

Of course, there are other problems with the ride. People wonder why the harnesses break a lot on that ride. Maybe, it's because full body weights are resting on those things once you go up and down the 90 degree first tower.

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Thursday, November 29, 2007 1:33 PM
I respect your opinion but I'm still not with you on the seating. To me, it's an example of an engineer "overthinking" a problem that really wasn't much of a problem in the first place. There are single riders lurking about parks but Deja Vu assumes that 50% of its riders will be singles, which is definitely not the case. A better solution to the single rider solution is for the ride ops to fill empty seats instead of creating special seats and forcing larger groups to splinter apart. As far as the "chickens" go, I don't think that was ever a factor. If you're riding a 200' tall inverted coaster, chances are fear isn't a problem.
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Thursday, November 29, 2007 2:03 PM
I am of the "loved the ride" side of things. Once I finally got to ride it. The intensity is great.

I like the standard boomerang but can only speak of the one at WOF. And I wasn't too impressed with Face/Off as far as inverts go.

Of the times I've been to SFGAm, Vu was not operating most of the time. But it added mystery and character to it. I could hear people discuss when it might be open that day, the complaints that it never seemed to be working, or stories of the last time someone got stuck on one of the towers. Deja Vu has a celebrity status for those reasons. Regardless of if it is good or bad, people know this ride.

But the second you would see that train go up during test runs, people would flock just to get the chance to ride it before it broke down again. Which in some ways can attribute to the long lines despite it's capacity issues.

I wonder if there has been any investment into alternate methods to make this ride work. Because when it works it's awsome. And when it doesn't... *** Edited 11/29/2007 7:05:44 PM UTC by WildThingNative***


Thanks for another great season, VF!

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Thursday, November 29, 2007 2:47 PM
Aside from the three U.S. versions and a ride that went to the WB theme park in Spain, Vekoma never sold another one of these coasters. Something tells me there was little interest and therefore no reason to improve upon the concept.
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Thursday, November 29, 2007 5:21 PM
Wild Thing is right--the ride had a certain mystique because of its tendency to be down. I know people would often look towards it in the middle of the day, see it testing, proclaim, "It's Open!!!" and flock to the ride. It was entertaining. Of course, I always followed the crowd.

I rode Face/Off this summer, and it became clear to me how superior Deja Vu is. Why? The intimidation factor generated by the vertical lifts and the greater height.

When I first rode Deja Vu in 2001, it was the first coaster that scared me since I was a little kid. I had never before felt like I was going to fall out of a ride climbing 200 feet, and it gave me quite a rush, as did the drop. The ride still delivers for me, whereas others (Raging Bull) lost their luster more quickly.

The ride has an unique and thrilling fear factor with its ascent (which you do twice), an excellent first drop and very good second drop, smooth and fun inversions, and the thrill of going forwards and backwards. From a ride experience standpoint, it's terrific--for me, clearly the best in the park.

Which leads me to leave you all with a question: Is there anything a park could do to alienate loyal patrons more than removing (arguably) its best ride, especially when that ride operated regularly last year? For me, this removal is a huge disappointment. I know I am only one person, but I will not be visiting this park (Great America) for awhile. I'm surprised more people aren't angry, or at least questioning the decision. We shall see how people react next summer.

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Thursday, November 29, 2007 5:25 PM
'Real coaster enthusiast?' Well, to me, a real enthusiast supports the longevity of rides like the Whizzer and Big Dipper, and the repair of classics like Revolution
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Thursday, November 29, 2007 5:54 PM
Mamoosh's avatar Amen Billy!...keep on preachin' ;)
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Thursday, November 29, 2007 5:58 PM
Thanks moosh! The Revolution is a work of art, and has been reduced to complete crap. Shoulder bars, a given, but all that hard breaking? Come on! I had an interview with the MM engineer in '95 and he was a total ass.
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Thursday, November 29, 2007 6:01 PM
Mamoosh's avatar Yer preachin' to the choir there stud! lol ;)
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Thursday, November 29, 2007 6:08 PM
ApolloAndy's avatar I happen to consider myself a "real coaster enthusiast" and really have no stake in the longevity of any ride because of age or status or anything that isn't directly related to the ride experience.

Hobbes: "What's the point of attaching a number to everything you do?"
Calvin: "If your numbers go up, it means you're having more fun."

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Thursday, November 29, 2007 6:12 PM
The Whizzer is so much fun. Many of the new 'big rides' are just that. They set records and look impressive. But whatever happened to a ride being plain "fun"?

Mindbender, SDLooper, Shockwave, Lazer, Whizzer, Zambezi Zinger, Tig'ger are just plain fun. Alot of fun. After I ride Raging Bull or Mellenium force for the 10th time, the thrill is gone.

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Thursday, November 29, 2007 6:15 PM

J7G3 said:
The Whizzer is so much fun. Many of the new 'big rides' are just that. They set records and look impressive. But whatever happened to a ride being plain "fun"?

Mindbender, SDLooper, Shockwave, Lazer, Whizzer, Zambezi Zinger, Tig'ger are just plain fun. Alot of fun. After I ride Raging Bull or Mellenium force for the 10th time, the thrill is gone.


And the Big Dipper was easily the best thrill and most popular ride at Geauga Lake.

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Thursday, November 29, 2007 6:57 PM

Kevin Max said:
Which leads me to leave you all with a question: Is there anything a park could do to alienate loyal patrons more than removing (arguably) its best ride, especially when that ride operated regularly last year?

1) Removing a classic signature family friendly ride for a unreliable ride that only a fraction of park guests can go on (54" min and 76" max).

2) Loss of secondary walkways, planters and theming (costumes for example).

3) Lack of cleanliness, poor staffing, lack of general upkeep.

4) Extremely high prices ($15 parking or $30 for prefered, $3-$4 soda)

Alot of the damage was done pre-Shapiro Six Flags, but Shapiro has done his damage as well.

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