Cedar Point's Valravn

Pretty sure he was just making a joke.

I don't know. That profile pic is all business.

Ensign Smith said:

It looks like Sauron is thoughtful.

Why hasn't LotR been franchised to any parks? Seems like fertile ground.

bjames said:

Why hasn't LotR been franchised to any parks? Seems like fertile ground.

Because of the Tolkien family. They would make working with JKR look like child's play.

Too complex a mythology or storyline, maybe? It seems to me that translating LOTR or the overly drawn out Hobbit trilogy of movies into an attraction would be difficult.

Although I haven't read six of the Harry Potter books and only seen bits and pieces of the movies, and have read LOTR, the Hobbit and most of the Silmarillion and seen most of the movies -- I love the Harry Potter attractions in Orlando.That there's my favorite part of IOA, frankly.

LotR ought to be perfect IP for a theme park. I can't imagine a better fit--it's right up there with Rowling and Star Wars. In fact, I can't imagine Disney didn't sniff out the licensing possibilities in the wake of Potter coming to Universal; they must have found the estate utterly intransigent to the concept, is all I can think of.

I thought Universal had considered LotR in the future.

I honestly can't see it. Don't get me wrong, I'd love to see it done right, and I love the movies (though I always think of "even the TREES walked in those movies"), but rides based on it? Hmmmm...

Now, an innovative water ride based on the river scene in The Hobbit (Desolation of Smaug) could be really cool. I can totally see that one.

Back to Valravn...it DOES seem like a weird fit for Cedar Point. They have a floorless coaster and a wing coaster, as well as an invert (AND an inverted spike coaster). Three out of four seem to very similar experiences, and even the GP would notice, I'd think. I'm not saying it is even a bad thing...it's not like I go to Great Adventure and say, "gee, it really sucks to have a large collection of B&Ms here". It works for them without a doubt, so why wouldn't it work for Cedar Point? It will be fun and huge, but I'd like to see them get a little bit more diverse I guess.

Ensign Smith said:
In fact, I can't imagine Disney didn't sniff out the licensing possibilities in the wake of Potter coming to Universal.

The exact details are hard to find, but it's my understanding that Disney got the right to first refusal to the Harry Potter theme park.

Everytime they asked the Tolkien family they got this response...

It's my understanding that Disney didn't have any right of first refusal. They were in negotiations with Ms Rowling and were ultimately unwilling to cede the creative control she was insisting on. Universal was willing.

But they got Avatar which is way better.

+1 to Bunky for the Randall quote.

I feel the same thing. A Dive Coaster, while great for the masses, really is redundant when you think about it.

Dragster, Wicker Twister, Gatekeeper (momentarily) all have vertical drops. Millennium Force and Maverick average each other out to vertical as well.

Add in what Bunky said above, and about the only thing unique to this coaster is the holding brake.

But, then again, am I excited for another new giant coaster at CP? You better believe it. I can think of a few things I'd rather do first if I ran the world, but not too many.

Tommytheduck said:

I feel the same thing. A Dive Coaster, while great for the masses, really is redundant when you think about it.

Parks add coasters for the masses. People who think about Dive Coasters being redundant aren't really on the park's radar.

Dive coasters offer a totally different experience than other similar coasters, in my opinion. Griffon at BGW blew me away, and I've been waiting for Cedar Point to get something like it for a long time now.

I've never been on a dive coaster, but isn't the holding brake the thing that makes a dive coaster? It is my understanding that the brake gives the first drop a somewhat free fall like feel to it which is a much different experience from a typical coaster drop, vertical or not.

The holding brake is a significant feature, but I wouldn't say it "makes" the coaster. I'd probably have the same (positive) opinion of the B&M dive coasters with or without it.

I can see why, from an enthusiast perspective, why this might seem redundant - but what's the alternative? CP has virtually every major ride type in its lineup. Flyers might be the major exception but CF seems to have little interest in new flyers and I can't blame them. The dive machine seems like a no-brainer to me. It will be big, flashy, high-capacity, and popular with the GP. Win win all around.

What Cedar Point really needs is a stand-up. Those things are here to stay.

I don't think it's any more rendundant than saying two coasters that loop are. Or two wooden coasters are. Or that all roller coasters use track to manipulate force on the rider's body so they're all basically the same thing.

Re: alternatives besides a dive coaster-

There are amazing things that can be done by RMC, Gravity Group, Mack, Premier, S&S Sansei, Gerstlauer, and others. I understand wanting a proven concept like a B&M Dive coaster, but I wish CF would give some of these others a try.

Those designers can do amazing things, sure, but I'm not sure of what they offer that wouldn't be redundant with other rides in the park (compared to a Dive Machine). RMC and Gravity Group build great rides but the park already has two woodies. An Iron Horse conversion for Mean Streak could be interesting but the park already has a couple of multi-loopers in its arsenal. Premier, S&S, Gerstlauer....the main offerings here seem to be multi-loopers that may or may not launch...the 4D concept is cool but CP already has Gatekeeper.

Just sayin'. I totally get that for this audience, yet another B&M is about as unusual as having a cup of coffee in the morning, but let's also note that CP already has a lonnnnng history of taking proven, reliable ride concepts, beefing up their stats 20%, and calling it a day. From a business view, to me, it's still a complete no brainer. It will be a slam dunk with CP's core audience.