Cedar Fair interested in AstroWorld?

Just chuckling imagining Dan Snyder, handkerchief over mouthpiece speaking in a lower register, calling into a CF board meeting... "So you think you might be interested in acquiring Astroworld? My name? err.... um, Slider, yeah that's it... Fran Slider."

difference between this and SFWoA, though, is that they wouldn't be getting rid of a boatload of animals in the process, which is essentially what led Geauga Lke to demise it's first year...

-- alan j

Here is to hoping Astroworld and the new Schlitterbahn Galveston are not harmed too much with Hurricane Rita.

Hurricane Rita

edit - - - fixed the link *** Edited 9/21/2005 10:56:21 PM UTC by beast7369***

Category 5 now. I've not been to SFAW in over 20 years, but if I remember correctly it seemed like the area around the park was really flat. I wonder if we'll be seeing a Katrina/SFNO repeat here. Keep in mind, TC is made of wood unlike MZ's steel structure.

Here's hoping for the best for everyone in the area!

*** Edited 9/21/2005 11:43:13 PM UTC by thrillerman1***

Well i would like to point out SFAW's maintenence is not a nightmare. those guys are good at their job.

The biggest problem I see is getting parts for Ultratwister and Batman: the escape and getting SFI to get other parts needed in a timely fasion.

Also, the parking situation can be resolved simply by flipping the front gate and aquiring land behind the park. There is a lot of unused land there that nobody seems to want. It would take trams to get the people to the park i believe, but Astroworld would no longer have to be dependent on the county for parking.

Why mess with relocating the gate. Just use the trams to get people from the back to the front.

That's a dream I share with both you & Crashmando there Colin,just imagine what CF could do with SFA....& I'm not just talking coasters here.

Because the current front gate borders a major highway and also uses a lot of land that could be used for other things.

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BATWING FAN SFA said:
just imagine what CF could do with SFA....& I'm not just talking coasters here.

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Everybody who believes that stand on your head.

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thrillerman1 said:
Category 5 now. I've not been to SFAW in over 20 years, but if I remember correctly it seemed like the area around the park was really flat. I wonder if we'll be seeing a Katrina/SFNO repeat here. Keep in mind, TC is made of wood unlike MZ's steel structure.

Here's hoping for the best for everyone in the area!

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Granted it looks like Rita's going to pack quite a whallop when it hit, but you also need to remember that while the winds did a bunch of damage to Biloxi and New Orleans, that is not what ultimately flooded SFNO. SFNO, along with most/all of the city of NO is built under sea level. The levees failed, flooding the city after the storm passed...if the levees had held and the pumps continued to work, the damage to NO would have been survivable for the city.

That being said, however, good luck to those in the way of this new storm and I hope they all make it through ok.

Being the business man that Snyder is, I would not put it past him to just throw CF into the mix to pump up the land value for real estate investment firms.

Even if CF was intrested, a confidentiality agreement has to be signed by both parties and with the closing just being announced a short time ago, these ideas/ decisions are, at best, premature.

CF paid $145 million for WoA, a park with lots of land and no parking problems, and has yet to make money.

The land that AW sits on is said to be worth about $145 million (let alone the equipment & facilities), and they would still have to figure out a solution to the parking problem which would be very costly.

I just don't see CF purchasing AW as being realistic. If it was going for a song, maybe. In this case the parts are worth more than the whole.

GAcoaster, it is for that very reason that the Cedar Fair purchase of Geauga Lake was wise either way. If they really can't make a go of it after a few years (which I don't expect to be the case) they can close the park, have the land rezoned residential, and that lake would make the land very valuable.

It depends how much SFI would be willing to sell to CF for, but if the margin is enough, I agree that it would make sense for CF to pocket a few $million just by buying the park, then turning around and selling it to developers.

With SFI desperate for cash at the moment, I can't imagine that they can fetch top dollar for it - they're too desperate to sell. CF, on the other hand, is doing pretty well financially, so it seems to me that they'd be in a better position to get more for the property.

But it's not just how desparate for cash SF is, it's also how badly some developer wants to get his hands on the land. Don't forget, the longer it takes for them to get the land, the more expensive it's going to be to construct whatever it is they want. Who knows, in another year or two, the real estate market could change drastically, so there's as much pressure on someone interested in buying the land as there is for SF to sell it.

My point is, the developers want the land.. I have no clue on figures, so I'll make some numbers up:

Let's say the land is worth 150million, developers offer SFI 100million because they know the situation SFI is in (both with the parking problem and financially). CF could offer SFI 110million, then sell to the developers for 125million, and make an easy 15million in the process.

Alternatively, CF could offer SFI 110million, sell to the developers for 110million, and "pocket" the rides for free / sell the rides for cash.

Edit: typos
*** Edited 9/24/2005 12:02:55 AM UTC by dannerman***

Guess the answer to that is how long SFI can afford to wait before selling out. They wouldn't be taking in any money by not opening and operating the park. Then again, they wouldn't have any of the expenses either.

If they're actually losing money annually on Astroworld, they are better off waiting then and letting the developers' drool a little bit. In a year or two, the cost of developing the property could increase by 10-20% or more. So the developer's costs go up far beyond the property cost alone.

Even if SF is desperate for the money, I still don't think you want to look too eager to sell, if only for the image you present to the business community, stockholders, and GP.

True they wouldn't be taking any money in, but they'd still be losing money on property taxes, etc.

So would the possible increase in value offset the amount of taxes they'd be paying for nothing? Although I'm not expert, I don't quite think so.. which is why this could be an opportunity for Cedar Fair (or any other company, really) to play the right cards and make some relatively easy money.

sorry for a dumb question but what is cedar fair?

What Snyder is doing here is simple. He's out to gain control of SF. Untill he does so, it's in his interest to have the price of SF stock as low as possible. Therefore, he's trying to block any action of SF's part that would improve their financial condition and raise the stock price.