Cedar Fair interested in AstroWorld?

Wednesday, September 21, 2005 11:47 AM
http://www.pointbuzz.com/news.htm?id=724

http://www.kfor.com/Global/story.asp?S=3868189&nav=6uy6

According to this SEC filing by Dan Snyder, Cedar Fair may indeed be considering buying the place. Never would have expected CF to buy Geauga Lake, so stranger things have happened.

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Wednesday, September 21, 2005 12:00 PM
Maybe the park can be saved after all.
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Wednesday, September 21, 2005 12:22 PM
CF also expressed interest in Visionland. So the question is, how much interest?
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Wednesday, September 21, 2005 12:34 PM
AstroWorld is bigger than Visionland though.
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Wednesday, September 21, 2005 12:39 PM
This would be awesome if they did. They should buy SFA. I'd love for them to slowly take over SF parks that have gone down the tube.
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Wednesday, September 21, 2005 12:40 PM
Don't you guys get SIZE DOESN'T MATTER? LOL!

Hey I am all for saving a park. And rides. Some just can't be replaced like they used to.


Katie

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Wednesday, September 21, 2005 12:43 PM
So was SFWOA...and it has yet to turn a profit.
There's this vast gulf between 'interest' and 'purchase' that has to be crossed.

CF folks would have to get a good look at the (reportedly aging) facilities, the rides (reportedly maintenance nightmares), the location (reportedly a parking horror) and then the price.

Meanwhile, remember the bearer of this news. SF management? CF management? Or a loose cannon who apparently didn't rouse enough attention last week?

I'm not saying it can't or won't happen...but I will caution you to look at the big picture.

-'Playa

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Wednesday, September 21, 2005 12:48 PM
The main problem if CP bought it would be finding a place to have customers park. Thats the #1 reason SF is getting rid of it. There is no place for customers to park anymore.
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Wednesday, September 21, 2005 1:08 PM
Why would Dan Snyder have any idea about what goes on in the Cedar Fair board room?
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Wednesday, September 21, 2005 1:10 PM
I have wondered if Six Flags is just playing the role of "if you don't play our way, we'll just take our toys and go play somewhere else".

I know that many times over, there have been businessess that have threatened to move, relocate, etc. (sports teams come to mind) if the county, city, etc. doesn't do as they would like. Sometime they move, and sometimes they finally come to an agreement.

If you go to some of the local's Astroworld websites you will see that they knew it was a distinct possibility that this was going to occur and tried to rally the troops to "Save Astroworld". Now that something has been announced - I wonder if that cry has gotten louder and if now the local government has begun to notice?

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Wednesday, September 21, 2005 1:50 PM
Why would CF tell Dan Snyder and not the people who actually make the decisions if they were interested in acquiring the park? And why would Snyder be against selling the park for commercial development, but in favor of selling it to CF to continue operations as a park?

Since the apparent reason for closing the park is the parking issue, why would we expect CF to be able to make a deal with the other parties? Why would we expect CF to even bother trying?

If CF were to come in and make a successful go of it, that would make Six Flags AND Snyder look like total asses. I don't think either of them would want to set up that possibility. I also don't think CF would want to take over a park that has little or no potential to survive.

Of course, CF could buy it then turn around and sell the land to developers for a huge profit and relocate the rides to its other parks. Anyone at SF for seconds on Humble Pie?

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Wednesday, September 21, 2005 2:21 PM
How would Snyder look like an ass? He's the one that opposes the sale, but I think the rest of your statement there goes along with the idea that Snyder has merely said this to get SF to rethink their decision.. and just why would CF tell Snyder that they were interested?

I agree with most of the things you say except I don't see how a CF turnaround would make Snyder look bad.

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Wednesday, September 21, 2005 2:36 PM
If Joe Blow Blumsky asks Richard Kinzel during a conference call if they'd be interested in purchasing more parks, he'd be told that they'd always consider something that made good sense to the company.

People have asked that question during the calls at least twice a year. They get the same stock answer.

Daniel Snyder doesn't gain any legitimacy by repeating a CF stock answer to a common question.

-'Playa

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Wednesday, September 21, 2005 2:57 PM
Why is it so hard to believe?

Snyder is trying to make the current Six Flags board look like a bunch of idiots that are out to make themselves look good, even at the expense of the stockholders. It would be in Snyder's best interest to see if the board had refused to look at other alternatives, such as selling Astroworld to another amusement operator.

Considering how much of Six Flags he owns and how much more he intends to purchase, I don't doubt for one minute that if Snyder wanted Kinzel's ear, he'd get Kinzel's ear.

*** Edited 9/21/2005 6:57:38 PM UTC by Rob Ascough***

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Wednesday, September 21, 2005 3:30 PM
But let's just say he did. And let's just say Snyder asked him about Astroworld. Why would he givee any different answer than the widely-disseminated, readily-public answer he's been giving for years on conference calls?

Interest is one thing. A definitive 'yea' or 'nay' depends on particulars Snyder isn't in a position to provide.

So could you be 100% correct about who talked to who? Absolutely! Does it actually mean anything of significance at this point if it happened? Nope.

-'Playa

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Wednesday, September 21, 2005 3:38 PM
Again, like mentioned before, there's a difference between interested and fully considering!

Even if Cedar Fair is interested, there are a lot of factors that could put them off on the acquisition - much like the disagreements on contract terms between Visionland management years back.

I'm pretty sure once Cedar Fair fully explores this option, they may find that it's not that of a move for them to make. Cedar Fair is going to have a tough problem on their hands - a hand to hand combat with Reliant Complex over parking spots like Six Flags did before announcing the sale of AstroWorld.

In addition, Geauga Lake has JUST begun to slightly pull itself out of a deep hole and turn a small profit, and I don't think snapping up another park is what's in their best interest right now. I know I know. Who am I to say what's in their best interest? Although on a smaller scale of Six Flags making the mistake of buying up parks in a short period of years, if Cedar Fair acquires AstroWorld, it would make it the Fourth AMUSEMENT PARK (NOT INCLUDING THE HUGE SLEW OF WATER PARKS PICKED UP ALONG THE WAY) they acquired in less than 9 years.

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Wednesday, September 21, 2005 3:41 PM

Crashmando said:
This would be awesome if they did. They should buy SFA. I'd love for them to slowly take over SF parks that have gone down the tube.

That would be my Dream!

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Wednesday, September 21, 2005 3:48 PM
Jophish, how it would be bad if CF were to acquire AW and run it successfully is that they would have done it while Burke and Snyder and their respective factions were busy sniping at each other and worrying less about how to actually run the park.

I really don't see it happening (CF acquiring it), so IMO it's pretty much a moot point... especially with another category 4 approaching. *** Edited 9/21/2005 9:53:36 PM UTC by RatherGoodBear***

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Wednesday, September 21, 2005 4:33 PM
What would be the downside, from Cedar Fair's point of view, of buying the park...salvaging and relocating the rides that they deem worthy...and then turning around and selling the land themselves? If the price was right it might not be a bad idea.

Conversely, what if Cedar Fair wanted to drastically change the park? Maybe they want to eliminate the dry rides, thus saving space, and concentrating on a water park and even something like a Castaway Bay.

It wouldn't surprise me at all if Kinzel was interested in acquiring another year-round facility.

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Wednesday, September 21, 2005 5:27 PM
Dan Snyder is just putting his head in too deep. He is the one that puts out a bunch of crap and hes yet to deliver anything, especially since he hasnt got six flags, i think he is making a push for his intrests and trying to put his name into things so the board at six flags decides hes the man for the job.
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