Cedar Fair announces Geauga Lake will be water park only

New paint is detail work. Replacing lighting systems is detail work. Those types of changes are ones that often make all the difference, but they're not the kinds of things that get people to a park in the first place. New rides get people to a park. Take down Steel Venom but replace it with a Gerstlauer spinning coaster... that sort of thing.

Interesting point about Top Spin- it was improved and more people paid attention to it. Too bad they didn't think of doing that with the rest of the park, new paint here and there notwithstanding.

*** This post was edited by Rob Ascough 9/24/2007 2:27:25 PM ***

All I'm saying is the ride side looked like it was about to close. The Texas Twister fact illustrates my point. When you put some TLC into sections of the park, people NOTICE and they appreciate it. So they painted a ride and a couple of other things. I'm talking about renovate an entire midway. Blow out the old water park and re-theme that entire midway where the two removed coasters once were. It's right on the street too. So, you get locals driving by, see some new stuff and think to go back.

Midway improvements like that don't take much money. But, they renew people's faith in the park. Adding a corn hole toss doesn't add much faith in the park.

^^Of course they competed. Certainly Geauga Lake didn't have the same number of attractions or as expensive or record-breaking in its day, but they are (excuse me, were) amusement parks. To Mr. and Mrs. Joe Schmo, that's the only thing that matters. Cedar Point had Blue Streak, Geauga Lake had Big Dipper. They both had Corkscrews, while GL had Double Loop. Both parks had their share of flats and dark rides; they both had sky rides and midways and arcades and game concessions and picnic groves and log rides and car rides and kiddie rides and observation towers and . . . the list goes on and on. They always competed. And now one of them has won.
*** This post was edited by Ensign Smith 9/24/2007 2:36:12 PM ***

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Ensign Smith:
Years ago, in the eighties, there was this great Mexican fast food chain called Zantigo. Some of you may remember it. Now I always hated Taco Bell, but I loved the cheese chilitos at Zantigo. Then, round about 1986, Taco Bell (Pepsico) bought the entire chain. They converted some of the units to Taco Bell, but mostly they just shut them down.

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You only reinforced the point I made in response to your last post.

Indeed - they shut them down. They didn't run them for several years in some weird attempt to mislead the public and then shut them down. They wanted the competition dead and they killed it...immediately.

You're right, it happens all the time. What doesn't happen all the time is some weird fantasy scenario where the new owners try to pull some off the wall decption for multiple years at their own expense before shutting things down.

I'll tell ya, Bill and Dick (and the gang) are probably sitting in their ivory towers right now just kicking themselves.

"Bill, why didn't you think of new paint?"

"Sorry Mr K, it just plain escaped me."

"Bill, you mean we should have tried adding rides instead of taking them out?"

"Hmmm, well Mr. K, I guess that is the other way we could have gone."

But, Tim....you take the cake. Do NOT underestimate the power of the corn hole toss.

What year did that commercial run when SFO basically said, "skip Cedar Point, we are better"? That certainly played in interesting role in the timing of when everything went south. You can't advertise that you are better...have hundreds of thousands of guests come only to find out you are not better...and expect them to come back.

Oh, I also wanted to add that there is no doubt the purchase of the Paramount Parks also played a role. I think the "good intentions" of Kinzel and the gang prior to the Paramount buy was to give Geauga Lake a chance to turn it around. The Paramount purchase certainly brought scrutiny to the company and I recall sitting in on one investors call when Dick was asked point blank how long he was going to let Geauga founder until the decided to cut bait. If the Paramount parks weren't bought then perhaps there would be a different outcome at Geauga.

But, I'm certainly not going to say they should have skipped the Paramount deal in order to make Geauga Lake work. I suspect few people here would argue that point.*** This post was edited by wahoo skipper 9/24/2007 2:41:01 PM ***

^^The difference is people don't get all panties in a bunch, let's handcuff ourselves in front of the bulldozers, picket chain headquarters upset when one fast food chain buys another.Amusement parks are different. People (and not just crazy enthusiasts like you and me) actually care about them. If CF had bought out Geauga Lake and announced its permanent closing the next day, the amount of protest would have dwarfed what they're seeing now. That kind of anger could actually have put a dint in their year-end numbers for CP. But now they can plausibly -- and to some people, apparently, credibly -- claim that at least they tried.Hogwash.
*** This post was edited by Ensign Smith 9/24/2007 2:40:37 PM ***

As for the comment that Six Flags tried adding new rides and it got them nowhere....................Six Flags added too much to the park too quickly, namely combining Sea World into the park and making it too big to manage, and managed it poorly overall.

You can add all the rides you want, but if the park is dirty, the rides are poorly operated and the staff is not friendly, people are not going to come back.

Six Flags greatly improved the park with the ride additions and marginal theming. It WAS phyisically a nice park in 2000.

I'm going to rant here just a little, but I have to give credit to millrace for helping me form this into something coherent. If you like what I have to say, I'll take credit and if you don't, you can blame Joe.

There's a huge difference between a local taco restaurant and an amusement park. Something like an amusement park becomes part of the community, especially when an amusement park has been around for close to 120 years. And because the amusement park became part of the community, it has a value in the eyes of the community. Cedar Fair determined that the rides side of Geauga Lake has no value, but judging by the outpouring of emotion that seems to extend way beyond the limits of this website, people in the community feel a little differently. People are emotionally invested in that amusement park, and for a company to take that lightly is to make a huge mistake, especially in this case where it seems to have been handled all wrong.

I don't support holding on to everything of this kind of intangible value- if something makes absolutely no sense whatsoever, the alternatives have to be considered. But to take something that was part of the community way before our parents and grandparents were born and kill it off after such a pathetic attempt to get things on track is just wrong. You're damn right this is an emotional thing, but it can't be ignored that emotions and business have to coexist with each other despite the two often having nothing to do with each other.

Nicely put.

So Rob, ask yourself this:

What would have happened if Geauga Lake announced it was closing the rides side a month or a season ahead of time. What does that do to the morale of the full time employees who have to get through that final time period?

What kind of unknowns might Cedar Fair have faced if they announced early they were going to close down forever? Vandalism? Theft? Disgruntled employees?

There is a reason you tell someone at the end of the day on Friday that they are fired. You avoid a lot of trouble. You don't say, "hey Chuck....we are going to fire you in three or four weeks so we just wanted to give you the heads up in case you wanted to take the mower for a few more spins."

And yes, the impact the announcement may have on Cedar Point and King's Island for that matter shouldn't be discounted. Look what people are saying here right now.

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If Cedar Point and Geauga Lake aren't in the same market

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Being in the same market is not the same as being competition. As Jeff pointed out earlier, Cedar Point's biggest market isn't even in Ohio. And even in Geauga Lake's own backyard, people viewed Cedar Point as a different experience.

Home Depot and a local family owned hardware store can be in the same market. The small hardware store may close because of Home Depot, but how often does Home Depot buy a small hardware store because it's the "competition?"

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wahoo skipper said:
But, Tim....you take the cake. Do NOT underestimate the power of the corn hole toss.

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Are you trying to say Corn Hole Toss was a good excuse for a park "improvement"? I know the game is fun and addictive - my family still lives in Ohio and I played maybe 20 games in a couple days. But, that hardly qualifies as a notable investment in a park you're trying to prevent from closing. What'd that cost the park? Maybe $500/$1000?

For those interested in the latest on the closing of Geauga Lake Park, please note that general manager Bill Spehn, is scheduled to speak at the local Board of Trustees Meeting in Bainbridge, Ohio, tonight.

This may give the media an opportunity to hear Mr. Spehn speak on the closing, while enlightening the public as to what plans there may be for the future of the park property. Please note that there will be PUBLIC COMMENTS at 7:00pm, and that Mr. Spehn will speak at 8:00pm.

Bainbridge Township Town Hall
17826 Chillicothe Road
Chagrin Falls, OH 44023
Tel: (440) 543-9871

As a representative of the American Coaster Enthusiasts, a national organization of over 8,000 members, I believe this is a great opportunity to ask questions in respect to the future of the property and to possibly determine what lead to the final decision to close this historic park.

Richard Munch
Historian
American Coaster Enthusiasts
Tel: (216) 223-3264

Matt Crowther
Preservation Director ACE
404-522-5458
mcrowther@mindspring.com

Sorry Tim...I didn't put my "sarcastic smiley" or LOL in that statement. No, of course I wasn't implying corn hole toss was an improvement.

I just happen to like corn hole toss and didn't want you to slight it.

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Ensign Smith said:
People (and not just crazy enthusiasts like you and me) actually care about them.

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Rob Ascough said:
Cedar Fair determined that the rides side of Geauga Lake has no value, but judging by the outpouring of emotion that seems to extend way beyond the limits of this website, people in the community feel a little differently.

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But did the community really feel differently? Even in the lone Plain Dealer article, the person interviewed admitted she hadn't been to the park in years. I realize that some will jump to blame Cedar Fair for that, but the truth is that Geagua Lake was never a huge draw for Northeast Ohio residents.

I would say there is a very small, but vocal, minority who is upset. I'm not saying there isn't an emotional attachment and being devastated is certainly a valid feeling. I don't think anyone is happy about the closing. But to say that emotions are producing less than rational thought is an understatement.

The outpouring of emotion online, especially in enthusiast forums, is a poor indicator at how the community feels overall. I've seen comparisons to Art Modell in various online forums. Are you kidding? Does anyone actually think this compares? This has hardly been on the news radar here in Cleveland.

*** This post was edited by Gemini 9/24/2007 3:08:27 PM ***

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Rob A:
You're damn right this is an emotional thing, but it can't be ignored that emotions and business have to coexist with each other despite the two often having nothing to do with each other.

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Not only can it be ignored, it should be ignored. Letting emotions get it the way of business is a surefire way to fail.

It shouldn't be emotional for you. It certainly wasn't for Cedar Fair and that's why they're able to make what they feel is the best business decision.

Sounds to me like you're stuck in a one-sided relationship. The girl you dig doesn't feel the same way about you and pursuing it is only going to leave you hurt. The worst part is I've seen this happen to you time and time again when a coaster or park goes bye-bye.

Maybe you should understand that in all of those cases the other side doesn't feel the same way about you. The best you can do is enjoy the fling - maybe you'll have a few good times, get laid and it'll be over. It was never meant to last. :)

Walt Disney wasn't passionate or emotional about his love for parks either. I guess that's why they are so successful.

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Walt Disney wasn't passionate or emotional about his love for parks either. I guess that's why they are so successful.

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Walt Disney was alive to see his first park operate for 11 years.

[/end Walt Disney's first-hand impact on his theme park business]

Hmmm.. well again, my "simple minded opinion."

Too bad they didn't try something like Holidayworld. Free soda, and treat people with respect.

Everytime I've been to Holidayworld, I always see Will, Pat or Paula walking around (sans stuffy ties and shiny 'gold tags') helping out, making sure people are ok, etc.

Holidayworld has free drinks and is friendly. People talk. People come, then more people come. They talk about the free pop on demeanor of the place, and want to come back and so on.

I'm sure that will be shot down, the success of a park hinging on a $2.50-$4.00 soda, but pretty much seems that simple to me.

My aunt is always ready to take her 3 kids to Kiddieland (along with me and my mother) simply because the have free pop! (and parking). The rides are basic, but fun.

She will not go to Great America. It would be worth it for her to pay even a bigger price to walk in the gate and get free soda than to pay $4.06 for a diet coke at Great America.

I just don't understand why people are comparing GL to MiA. The only things in common are their attendance levels and revenue. GL was a mega park it revenue and attendance levels should of been up near Dorney's and Great America's or even higher. To me it's like comparing a Geo Metro to a Chevy Suburban. They are in two different classes, but both have similar components.
*** This post was edited by otterkpr 9/24/2007 3:24:11 PM ***