Boring coaster design age.

Saturday, October 16, 2004 1:41 PM
Well, with recent announcement and new rides making their way to our favorite amusement parks, I have seen the same excitement for the bland rides coming for 2005 as much as the hype for Millenium Force.

Am I the only one confused with the incredibly unimaginative layouts of the new millenium? Has the launch system started an age that will plague parks with a collection of rides that lose their zing after a few years?

Don't get me wrong, it is cool to break new height barriers, but I am personally pretty much disgusted with the new layouts we are encountering in recent years. Major additions of the last couple years have outstanding and unbelievable elevations, but a glimpse of a top-view leaves MUCH to be desired.

When Xcelerator debuted, I thought it was a decent looking ride for the footprint it fit in, and I was anxious to see what was coming. Then Dragster made it's way into our coaster-driven lives, and all imagination has seemed to disappear.

I mean, come on, look at how excited some people were that Kingda Ka would feature a bunny-hill. Excitement over a bunny-hill is pretty obnoxious, but we have nothing else to look forward to.

With all this talk of future additions and new height classes making their entrances, I really am concerned with how these rides will stand the test of time. Many have already sensed immunity to TTD's launch after only one year of operation. There is no longer an unknown, everything is exactly as it was the ride before. This age of impulse coasters, rockets, half-pipes, and other straight line top view coasters has a remarkable reflection of what happened to Disney after Walt passed on.

Anybody else concerned about the loss of creativity in coasters? I mean, the only truly unique expansion I can recall for next year in America, is Hydra. All others follow the new trend that will plague us.

*This is exclusively my opinion, don't flame for having a different one.

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Saturday, October 16, 2004 1:50 PM
TTD and Kingda Ka and Xcel are just three coasters. Just look at the creativity in coasters like Hades, Hyrdra, Thunderhead, Storm Runner, etc etc etc...

I think coasters are just as creative now as they ever have been. At least we don't have Boomerangs and SLC's springing up as much anymore.

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Saturday, October 16, 2004 2:32 PM
^Thank God for that. Can't wait for Hades!
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Saturday, October 16, 2004 3:13 PM
Spoken like someone who's never experienced a real launcher.

In this case, real = hydraulic. V2 isn't even close. Even VF's SV is faster than that thing...and again, it isn't close either.

-'Playa

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Saturday, October 16, 2004 4:34 PM
SFgamDieahard said,

"I mean, come on, look at how excited some people were that Kingda Ka would feature a bunny-hill. Excitement over a bunny-hill is pretty obnoxious, but we have nothing else to look forward to."

Give them a chance. in the late 70's coasters would travel up a lift hill go through a corkscrew and hite the breaks. Now corkscrews have turned into just part of rides.

I feel the same thing might happen with coasters like TTD that feature just a top hat and a wild launch. In lets say ten years that will just be one of many elements on one ride.

But wait, Storm runner has already done that.

Where getting there! *** Edited 10/16/2004 8:35:54 PM UTC by GIGAFORCE01***

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Saturday, October 16, 2004 5:37 PM
I think the complete opposite. I feel that, though there are so far less announced coasters for next year (hey,we're in the off season, that will definitly change), we're getting more quality rides than quantity. Here is my theory:

TTD was built for last year. I'm sure that Ka had already been decided upon at that point, and Intamin probably said, you don't just want a faster, taller model of what CP is getting, do you? Thus the bunny hill (but again,thats my opinion, YMMV).

Look at what we got for 2004. RCDB lists 92 coaster installations for 2004. Granted, some of them have just opened, or are yet to open, like Silver Bullet, Sky Wheel, El Supermano, and many others. Some of those are relocations, and some are clones. I can't speak on El Supes (R.I.P. Chris Reeves), but SB and SW are either new concepts that look cool, or new layouts that are much different than we're used to from companies.

Plus, in 2004, we got some new woodies that people are raving about. We have the MS and Gerst. spinners, a half pipe, a very different Rocket layout, a Eurofighter, booster bike, the Mummy coasters, Gerst. Bobsleds...plus many more. New concepts were further explored or introduced this year.

For next year, we have a total of 23 announced new coasters. With the Cypress Gardens coasters, Silver Bullet, and a few others yet to open, you could almost add those to next season for most people as well. But things that are going in next year look good to me anyhow.

Hydra-very very different floorless. Looks fun
Hades-if what we keep hearing is true, Mmm...Tasty.
Kanonen-a new, compact, different pocket rocket.
Another launch coming to Alton. Is it an Intamin? Is it a Veko Booster Bike? Either way, I'm sure it will be fun.
We have IJ: ST. I'm really excited about this! Highly themed launch coaster for the family.
We're getting a new Space Mountain.
Raging Spirits sounds interesting, but I still don't know much about it.
Turbulence also sounds like major fun!
Powder Keg is still kept in some secrecy, esp. since it seems the known layout will indeed be different.

Then we have some new takes on new and old coaster types.

Kingda Ka is only one coaster. It is more or less an extended clone, much like an Extended SLC is an extended clone of an SLC, if you ask me(you didn't, but oh well...;)).

I think that so far, we're getting some pretty quality rides coming next year. And really, AFAIC, I'm not likely to be riding every new coaster, whether unimaginative or cloned, or fresh and new, next year. Heck, there are still plenty of older coasters I need to try out...

P.S. Out of the 23 annnounced coasters, only 6 of them are launched. 2 Premier, 2 confirmed Rockets, 1 possible Rocket or Booster Bike, and 1 S&S. *** Edited 10/16/2004 9:43:34 PM UTC by TeknoScorpion***

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Saturday, October 16, 2004 7:58 PM
Coaster creativity salvation lies in the minds of B&M.

Seriously, they're the only ones in the industry with their heads screwed on straight (manufacturers or parks). I like to think that parks approach them all the time and ask them to lease their talent to create dull rides that simply raise the record breaking notch. I further like to imagine their response to be, "No."

I'm happy that there's at least one firm out there stoutly holding to values of grandeur and innovation.

As far as I'm concerned, other manufacturers and parks could run themselves into the ground with their trend-driven, flash-in-the-pan, excuses for roller coasters.

One more thing. What happened to wooden coasters? Huh? Why must they be unrideable giants? I dare a manufacturer to think like Traver, Miller, Prior and Church. Those rides are legendary. People would love them. Parks could afford them. Lots of them.

*** Edited 10/17/2004 12:27:02 AM UTC by Rollerhammer***

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Saturday, October 16, 2004 10:46 PM
Rollerhammer said,

"I like to think that parks approach them all the time and ask them to lease their talent to create dull rides that simply raise the record breaking notch. I further like to imagine their response to be, "No."

I would not say that's always true. what about the dive machine. After the plunge thats about it.

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Saturday, October 16, 2004 11:17 PM
The revolution of roller coaster technology I don't find boring at all. These record breaking launchers represent the begining of the end of lift hill construction. Once the novelty of the lauchers ware off, they will build longer launchers. We can be irritated by the slow pace of technology, or we can be excited by it. There is a lot more going on for roller coasters then these short, record breaking novelties that are catching most of the headlines. Look harder SFGAMDie HARD.
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Saturday, October 16, 2004 11:41 PM

Rollerhammer said:One more thing. What happened to wooden coasters? Huh? Why must they be unrideable giants? I dare a manufacturer to think like Traver, Miller, Prior and Church. Those rides are legendary. People would love them. Parks could afford them. Lots of them.

See this is where Claire and the rest of the GCII team come into play. They are making great woodies that are very re-rideable. In fact I think parks that have not hired them yet to build a woodie need a check-up (from the neck up). At least one chain has their head on right (HFEC/Dollycorp).

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Sunday, October 17, 2004 12:03 AM

SFGAMDie HARD said:

Anybody else concerned about the loss of creativity in coasters?


No, I got other things to worry about. I ride and read about coasters for fun. No need to worry about fun.

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Sunday, October 17, 2004 12:16 AM
My concern with the launch is partly due to space/cost limitations as well. All of you talk of this being the beginning of a new age w/o lifthills, but geez, TTD cost a staggering $25 million, as much as Millenium Force. That is a ridiculous amount for a coaster of that length IMO. Also, when we make rides faster and taller, and eventually (hopefully) longer and more creative, there has to be a place to put them and the funds to build them.

I just don't see the hype that's all, and I kind of see this turning into something bad in the future. I think there are more and better ways of improving the coaster riding experience w/o the same old launch time after time.

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Sunday, October 17, 2004 12:26 AM
Hades, Hydra, Italian Job, Powder Keg, Booster Bikes, Journey to Atlantis, Revenge of the Mummy, SIlver Bullet...why is it that a few bad apples always seem to spoil the bunch? We get a world record breaker that, sure, isn't really the most original design, but you have to look past the spotlight on that coaster. There have been PLENTY of coasters to open recently or will be opening in 2005 that completly redefine coaster design. Not only new and unique designs from manufacturers that tended to have very formulaic designs, but also completly new types of coasters, hybrid rides, and the newest trend in the coaster world, coasters with a story that extends through the ride (Mummy, Itiallian Job, Everest...(then again all Disney coasters have a good story with good themeing all ready, it's just other parks picking up the trend))...When the economy gets a little better, and companies (especially SF) start spending more annualy, you should really start to see a boom in unique rides...
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Sunday, October 17, 2004 12:44 AM
Dont forget about Everest, I fully expect that coaster to be amazing (BTMR to the extreme) ride once Disney gets done with it.
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Sunday, October 17, 2004 12:57 AM
The complaint about TTD's layout is less original than the layout. If it is not for you, don't worry about it. Others like it. Do you think all drop towers are unimaginative too?
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Sunday, October 17, 2004 1:06 AM

GIGAFORCE01 said:

I would not say that's always true. what about the dive machine. After the plunge thats about it.



Swoosh said

See this is where Claire and the rest of the GCII team come into play. They are making great woodies that are very re-rideable.


Yeah, you guys are right. Too much pent up end-of-season/back-to-college rage over here. It's going to be a long off season for me.

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Sunday, October 17, 2004 5:57 PM
about the dive machine

I think it's pretty safe to assume that B&M will take that concept to a new level in 2005-2006 with the BGT coaster..

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Sunday, October 17, 2004 7:54 PM
I have to agree with SFGAMDie HARD. Looking at Great Adventure, the last imaginative coaster we got was probably The Chiller. Nitro and Medusa have great layouts but they have no theming. Superman has an incredibly short layout and Kingda Ka is just really tall and fast. I love all the coaster we've got and are getting but I would rather see more coasters like the Incredible Hulk, Dueling Dragons and the Mummmy's Revenge being built. They hold an atmosphere more than a record. I lost so much respect for other coasters after I got back from Florida because the coasters there are too awesome. A lot of us here are diehard coaster fans and love the ride but you have to think about how much personality and thought goes into these coasters. Hydra is an exception thanks to the JoJo roll and it's wicked layout.... But, Again, I bring up the Hulk and it's store line, main design, mid lift launch, and station theming. All those together make a Great Coaster.

The Italian Job Ride....As a Mini owner, I have to say this ride is a joke. 40mph is my average speed. When you're motoring, ESPECIALLY in Italian Job terms, you have to go a lot faster than that.

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Sunday, October 17, 2004 10:41 PM
My average speed on the highway in my old Metro is 60. Thrilling? Not hardly. But you launch me out @ 60mph on FoF, and I'm thrilled. MPH has little to do with a launch, IMHO. Heck, 120mph in a car(yes, I've done it), is no where near as thrilling as Launching @ 120mph...
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Sunday, October 17, 2004 10:45 PM
I doubt the 120 mph was done in a Metro though, right? ;)
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