Are hotels just to sleep at?

But it's not fair to me that they charge a price I didn't pay for the room!

Lord Gonchar said:

But you should never, never pay when you get walked. If the hotel can't honor your reservation you never pay for their mistake. You get a room at a nearby hotel and the hotel picks up the charge for your inconvenience. I've never heard in my life of a hotel expecting you to pay for a walk.

I've only had it happen to me once. They got me the name of the hotel about 10 miles away and I asked the girl at the front desk what I should say when I get there so that I don't get charged. She said, "of course you'll have to pay" and we went back and forth a few times. Finally she went to get a manager and somehow a room had opened up at the hotel I was staying at to begin with. Don't remember if I paid for that room or not, but I think I did. It was the original room and rate I agreed to anyway.

My hotel preferences have changed dramatically over the last 15-20 years of travelling. Sometimes I think back to some of the hotels I've stayed at and can't believe I ever did that. Like the hotel where I literally ran from my car to my room in fear of my safety. Or the time I was walking in my room and felt softness in the floor...discovering it was literally a hole in the floor with the carpet stretched tight over it...and I went back to that hotel the next year, too.

It all ended for me on a stay in Toledo. I pulled into the parking lot, looked around and thought, "There's no way I can stay here." I locked my car door, called the hotel from the parking lot, cancelled my reservation, and have never stayed in a cheap hotel since.

I can relate; the catalyst for me was a motel in Trenton, NJ on a trip to Great Adventure. Excerpt from a different trip report on a later Great Adventure visit:

[...]looking for the cheapest possible lodging, I found the Econo Lodge in Bordentown with a rate of only $60 a night. Thank the Lord (Gonchar) that before I booked the hotel, I read his SFGAdv trip report from June beforehand, in which he described this particular Econo Lodge as "the single worst hotel ever to book a guest." I'm skeptical about the accuracy of this statement, as I'm nearly positive Liz and I stayed at a motel in lovely Trenton 5 years ago that would easily steal that title and make fun of the Econo Lodge for being so neat and tidy. At 55 bucks a night (wouldn't have been surprised if I saw hourly rates), we were blasted with the smell of piss when we opened the door, slept fully-clothed on top of the bedspread and balled up our sweatshirts to use as pillows, and showered with our sandals on the next morning. If you ever come across this place (I think it was called 'Motel'), do NOT stay there. But whatever, I didn't want to chance sleeping in another craphole, so I booked us a room at the Bordentown Comfort Inn instead.

I'm pretty sure that I stayed in that Econo Lodge in Trenton when I was a teenager. It was pretty bad.

Are we telling hotel horror stories? :) A few years ago, my cousins and I went to American Idol winner David Cook concert in Elkins, WV. The concert was pretty good, but after the show, the hotel we booked creeped us out...

The hotel looked strange, but kind of familiar from the outside. The walk from the lobby to the room was also strange, but strangely familiar. The building was unique for a hotel, and very odd. We got to our room, and I plopped down on the bed and looked around. I mentally felt very uncomfortable for some reason. There were strange sounds coming from other areas of the hotel. The floor was cold and hard. The walls were made of painted cinder blocks. The room was very different than other hotels I have stayed at. Then it hit me. This hotel used to be a Hospital.

We hightailed it to the lobby and asked for a refund. There was no way we were going to sleep in a hotel that used to be a hospital. We received no refund, no option to move to another hotel, and we had to drive three hours back home that night anyways.

True story.

Don't automatically count out a hotel because it is cheap.
Back in October, I had to spend a few days in Scottsdale, AZ. Being severely underemployed, I couldn't afford to spend a lot on a room, and I found one for $cheap. I mean ridiculously $cheap compared to the rest of the market.

When I got there, I feared for what I would find. Would I be in the war zone? Well, the hotel was surrounded by car dealerships...for Mercedes, Lexus, Maserati, and Ferrari. The motel was ancient, and it looked like it had originally had double-sided rooms (doors to the parking lot as well as the inside courtyard) but a reasonably smart remodel had traded easy access for a much larger counter and a small refrigerator. Most important, it was clean, the beds were good, the wifi worked well, and there was a fair amount of space in the room.
Yes, the place is ancient. Yes, they had an outdoor pool, courtyard and aviary. I don't think they had breakfast but I didn't notice as my medication makes the prospect of breakfast a complicated timing issue and I had early meetings.

It wasn't the greatest place to stay, but unlike most <$80 rooms it ended up being a really good value. Pity most coaster people have very little reason to go to Scottsdale!

--Dave Althoff, Jr.

Timber-Rider said:

The only pitfall of doing this was the "Bait N Switch" tatics at a certain hotel chain in Sandusky. Reserved the Sandusky room, only to arrive and be routed by the desk to a different hotel in Norwalk. As they said they were "full" even though I had a reservation. Paid $109.00 a night, for a room that was nothing like the one I thought I was paying for. And, my indoor pool was downgraded to only an outdoor pool.

As Gonch explained, this is called a "walk" in the industry. It is very common in high competition areas. The hotel takes more reservations than it has rooms and hopes to get just enough cancellations and no shows to even out. I have never heard of a hotel charging more for a walk situation, as was said previously, it is the hotel's fault and they should pay.

Again I know I am just echoing Gonch's statements, but I feel it bears repeating that this is not some weird Bait N Switch tactic, but a fairly common situation that (unbeknownst to you) your actions led to you being singled out as the unlucky person that got walked.

I am guessing you probably used a third-party website to make the reservation. This is likely what caused you to be placed on the walk list. Hotels make very little from them compared to reservations made through their own systems. Often times you are treated worse than other Guests because they are making so much less from you. Length of Stay is also a factor in a decision on who to walk, if you only stay one night it is significantly easier to find a room for you elsewhere than if you were staying multiple nights.

Here is a tip for you folks... most OTAs (Online Travel Agents) charge 30% commission, so if you are to call the hotel directly (not the 1-800 reservations line, but the local number for the hotel) you are usually able to negotiate room rates and can very likely get 20% off your room rate.

That said, the rate I have set up for enthusiasts at Santa's Lodge is already 20% off (a little more than that if you opt for queens) saving you the hassle.

Timber-Rider said:
The worst thing about that is that same room cost $295.00 a night depending on what day and what month it is. To me, that's just wrong. But, they get away with it.

We have suites here that get close to that. I have people tell me all the time that it is ridiculous that they cost that much (my own staff included). However, my argument always is that if it is indeed too much, then why am I selling out of rooms? If I was losing revenue because they were not filling up, I can see the argument. Just because you personally won't pay that much or see the value in it doesn't mean that somebody else isn't willing to pay or doesn't appreciate the room for what it is worth.

a_hoffman50 said:

Here is a tip for you folks... most OTAs (Online Travel Agents) charge 30% commission, so if you are to call the hotel directly (not the 1-800 reservations line, but the local number for the hotel) you are usually able to negotiate room rates and can very likely get 20% off your room rate.

I've given this same advice on CoasterBuzz as many times as I can.

I'm amazed at how an industry sprung up, inserted themselves between the customer and the product as a middleman and convinced people they're getting the best rate that way.

You'll NEVER get a lower rate than you will contacting the property directly.

I broke it down in this post from last year:

Gonch dispensing the wisdom last May said:

Actually, the reason so many hotels have begrudgingly let rooms go on the discount sites is because so many people use them to book rooms. And I can assure you (yet again) that you're not getting a substantially lower rate...and you're certainly not getting the best rate - stop and think about it, those sites are middlemen, some of the cut goes to them...the room rate they pay is lower than what they're charging you.

The reason the hotels give them that lower rate is because they book so many rooms - think of it like a group rate. When you book a wedding or event or something, you get a lower rate for booking so much business. Booking with the discount sites is like booking as part of a big group. That's a different kind of discounting than what the Marriott guy is talking.

In fact, I did a little research for you. (and gave my wife a quick call to confirm and/or fill in some numbers for me)

On the discount sites, my wife's hotel is showing a $124 rate. On the company's website, it's showing $124. Most likely the hotel is charging them (the discount sites) in the $101 - $105 range. They (the discount sites) match the rate on the company site and the additional $19-to-$23 goes to the middleman.

Interestingly, it's way slower tonight than expected and if you give them a call (or walk in) they'd put you in at $99 tonight. But you're not going to get a "it's going empty anyway" rate any lower than that.

Always call the hotel directly for the best rate.

Gonch and Andy any insight as to why Hotwire seems cheaper? They usually don't tell you what hotel till after you book. Any suggestions there?

Whenever I call a hotel directly, the "best rate" they give me is the same price -- to the penny -- as what I get from their website, with our without the AAA discount. When you suggest "negotiating" a price, what exactly does one say? Do I tell them "that's more than I was looking to pay, so I'll check around with some other hotels and get back to you" to try and bluff them? Unless it's the day before and they're really struggling to fill rooms, I don't see how I have any leverage on my side when they can just wait for someone else to come along who's willing to pay full price.

Tek, that is called an opaque listing. It's a bit of a gamble. Often times even if you tell them the amount of beds you need it doesn't get communicated to the hotel. Those commissions are usually more so the OTA makes a decent amount of money and require the hotel to offer an extremely low rate to stay within the competitive set.

Birdhombre, use the term Best Available Rate. Tell them that is more you want to spend and ask if there is any flexibility in that price. Be nice while doing this. In this case you will definitely benefit from being extremely nice and friendly. If you make them want you at the hotel, they are more likely to help you. You can say that you are going to shop around, but it won't always get you results because the hotels do their own shopping around as well and already know what the other hotels will say. Also, it just extremely important to call the local number as their 800 number usually doesn't go to the hotel, but to a central reservation office where they are trained to sell and have less flexibility in rates.

Andy's got you guys covered. :)

Just want to add:

birdhombre said:

I don't see how I have any leverage on my side when they can just wait for someone else to come along who's willing to pay full price.

Yeah, in that case you don't. If a hotel is selling (or expected to sell), there's not going to be any play in the rate.

This is where waiting until the last minute works to your advantage - with the caveat that if rooms are selling, the rate isn't dropping. No industry follows the basic rules of supply and demand more closely than hotels.

For example, this past Friday my wife's hotel was running slower than expected. The girls at the desk knew to offer a lower rate than was available online. As the day went on and things stayed on the slower side of expectations, the 2nd shift was offering a lower rate than the first and, by the end of the day, the 3rd shift an even lower rate than the second. The traffic just wasn't there.

Don't expect miracles, but anyone who walked in after 10pm or so was definitely paying $30 less than someone who booked online.

Just keep in mind that while the hotel wants to fill rooms, there is a point where rate integrity breaks. So no, you're not walking into any remotely decently run hotel in the middle of the night and getting some ridiculous discount just because "it's better to fill the room than have it sit empty" - because, quite frankly, that's not necessarily true.

a_hoffman50 said:

You can say that you are going to shop around, but it won't always get you results because the hotels do their own shopping around as well and already know what the other hotels will say.

This. So much this.

All the hotels in a given market know exactly what the other hotels in the same market are doing - rate, occupancy...the whole shebang. The entire industry thrives on knowing their market, knowing their customers, knowing traffic patterns and maximizing revenue based on that knowledge.

Sorry to resurrect this old one, but you know I have to share when I come across something that makes me think of you guys.

Even better if it can turn into a junk tugging session for myself.

Looks like the rest of the world is finally catching up to what your ol' buddy Gonch has been telling you for years (five posts above this one):

https://www.mainstreet.com/article/why-its-time-to-book-travel-dire...-airlines/

And if I may tug my junk a little more vigorously for a moment - it's creepy how similar the info in the article is to what I was saying back then.

So keep this in mind as the coaster travel season is just starting to get into swing - if you staying anywhere worth its weight in gravy, odds are you'll get the best deals by contacting the hotel directly.

Whether or not having to pick up the phone and talk to a human is worth it is up to you. :)

---

ETA - Credit to Andy too. He added some great info to the discussion along this vein. Feel free to tug your junk as well, man!

Why don't you just tug his junk for him?

It's not just hotels & airlines that fall into this booking trap... How about TicketMaster? Quick example... I took my son to Monster Jam at the Carrier Dome in Syracuse, NY. I had a BOGO promo code. Went to TicketMaster website, found decent seats. They were listed at $40.40 for the pair including TM & facility fees. Very good, sold. But then TM wouldn't let me print the tickets or (even more irritating) offer digital tickets via smartphone... I had to PAY an additional $3.50 to drive to a TM retailer to pick up physical tickets. First class mail was an option, for the low low price of $6! Grrr... But wait, there's more! Then they whacked me an additional $5.75 proccessing fee! When I got my receipt it broke down as follows:

Tickets $12.50 x2
TM fee $5.70 x2
Facility fee $2 x2
Pickup fee $3.50
Procecessing fee $5.75

So out of a total bill for $49.65, $25 was spent on tickets while $24.65 was TicketMaster stealing my wallet. Had I gotten ahold of the promo code sooner I would have had a buddy pick up the tickets at the Carrier Dome box office. Ridiculous.

Here's an alternative method to booking a hotel... What about Hotwire.com? I've booked several hotels through them. I wants to return to one of the hotels a year later, they wouldn't even come close to matching the Hotwire price from the year before, so I booked through Hotwire again and got the same rate within a couple dollars.

And Southwest had always said they offer their lowest prices at Southwest.com...

Ticketmaster didn't steal your wallet or whack you for fees; you voluntarily opened your wallet and gave Ticketmaster every penny it asked for.

For all the complaints, clearly Ticketmaster has priced all those charges at a level you're willing to accept.

Unless the venue does not do will call, you can avoid that charge by picking them up at the box office, and you can avoid service charges entirely by buying tickets at the venue's box office. Inconvenient? Sure.

Point being that I was willing to pay the $40.40 the tickets were advertised for, including the fees. What burned me was the hidden pickup & processing fees.

I usually avoid TicketMaster at all costs for this very reason. See the part where I mention had a gotten ahold of this promo code sooner etc? A friend forwarded the code to me at 10pm the night before it expired. Otherwise I would've made arrangements to get them from the box office (which is 2 hours away).

I worked for Ticketmaster for six years, and currently work at a venue that uses Ticketmaster. I know Ticketmaster all too well.

I'm not a fan of the company. At all. That said...

I'm afraid you stumbled on a pet peeve of my mine. No one needs to see Monster Jam or Blue Man Group or that awful Broadway-bound version of First Wives Club. When someone goes to hyperbolic statements about TM fees, I just can't take the complaint seriously.

Walmart sells tickets from Ticketmaster, and there are no surprise fees, if I recall correctly. They print your tickets right there.

As I've said -- not a fan of Ticketmaster, but...

...they don't have surprise fees or hidden fees. They just don't. They have fees that many people ignore or don't pay attention to, but they aren't hidden and they aren't a surprise.

I just now "bought" a ticket for Blue Man Group on Ticketmaster (I closed the window once I'd reached the payment part of the process). I was told the ticket price, I was told how much the service charges totaled, I had the option to click through for a breakdown of those charges, and I had the opportunity to choose which delivery option I wanted, from expensive overnight delivery to no charge will call.

No charge will call wasn't offered. And the next window was where they give you (what should apparently be viewed as) the gift of the processing fee.

Look, if it's not either included in the advertised price or mentioned up front, it's a hidden fee. Airlines got in trouble for this crap and now have to show their final price when you select a ticket.