Trains on New England's Superman collide

Batwing - The train would not of been let off the lift hill if the one behind it was not in the station. I think it has a three block system, the lift hill, station, brake run/coarse. Then again if the computer fails then anything can happen.

Some people on this site need to be a whole lot more compassionate and less selfish. There a lot of people who's only concern was that the ride would open for their trip. Let's not forget the victims, who may never ride another amusment ride ever again. And people who are connected to them-friends, family etc. may decide to do the same. It's not a good situation at all. And let's not call the ride ops retarded, unless they actually are.

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Batwing-Bow Down

Unless they popped the ride into manual mode, I'm not prepared to blame the ride operators for this one. The train crashed a block brake, something the automatic safety system is specifically designed to prevent, which means that one way or another, the automatic safety system failed. Whether that was caused by a mechanical failure or a hardware failure or a bit of brain-dead programming, we really don't know.

--Dave Althoff, Jr.

supermandl: The death report came from some local paper out west. I have the link at home, but when I checked it late last night, the story was already gone.

DragonCyrs: If Markey was never born, this would have been reported (poorly or otherwise). He has zero to do with this.

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Jeff
Webmaster/Admin - CoasterBuzz.com
"From the global village... in the age of communication!"

RideMan: Surely changing from automatic to manual mode would require a lockout and only the personnel with appropriate clearance have those keys. Further, common sense would dictate (and mandate) that absolutely no people could ride in 2-train manual mode.

I always read your insights and opinions with interest.

Dan

I agree. The media is making a huge deal about this just like the kids that catch the wrong plane. It happens all the time. Rides stall and break down just like people miss their flights. No one was killed and the ride will be open in a few days. It's all good.

SKYHAWK : "Its all good"?????? Someone very easily could have been killed!! That ride is not going to be open in a couple of days. What kind of crack are you on if you think that this is some routine event? I have yet to see a huge deal in the media local or national. Yes the numbers have been different for the number of injured but aside from that its not exactly being plastered here and there. In MA last nights Red Sox game is bigger news. Yeah rides break down all the time but they don't usually send people to the hospital when they do.

RideMan said "The train crashed a block brake, something the automatic safety system is specifically designed to prevent, which means that one way or another, the automatic safety system failed. Whether that was caused by a mechanical failure or a hardware failure or a bit of brain-dead programming, we really don't know." Couldn't have said it better. Until we DO know, all S:ROS rides should run one train maximum - safety being ultimately more important than wait times.


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rollergator - intent on improving the "guest experience" - coming soon to a park near you

At the risk of being flamed to a crisp I submit the following.
This year alone there have been far too many of these "minor accidents". None of them are minor so far the parks, ammusement companies, fairs whatever have been lucky and only one death that I saw has occured so far this year.
Why do I say lucky?
Here is what we have observed in our park travels this year so far.
SFGADV - Last Sunday
Medusa - Ride operatior distracted making a pass at a female crew member. Crew members playing grab A## on the platform and talking with people standing by the exit. (reported to management) we didn't ride we didn't feel safe.
Rodeo - Operator looking at scenery along the lake while ride was running with people aboard.
Log Flume - Operators doing paperwork not paying attention to guests bording and unloading, operators at drops one was sleeping.
Went to other side of park via sky ride only one operator on each platform cars stacked up.
I could go on but I think you get the point.
We have experienced the same thing at Dorney and at Hershey this year.
The question becomes, do the parks need to come up with more responsible (or mature) operators or do they need to supervise the operations more?
I don't have an answer but, if this scary trend continues sooner or later we are going to have a really tragic accident.

So have any facts been given on exactly what happened? Did all of the brakes fail to engage, because after a trains comes off that last bunny hop it is flying into the brakes. If all of the breaks failed I would think that there would have been more damage.

With everything said, I still cannot see how this could possibly be blamed as operator error. In this day and age of control equipment, there should be no way that an operator could bump trains, Auto Mode, Manual Mode, or otherwise. If what others have said is true about a faulty sensor, then I blame it on a serious failing of not having a redundant system.

First rule of thumb in redundant control systems. There should be no way that a single point failure can cause an accident.

I run an Intamin rollercoaster (Lightning Bolt at MGM) and whenever we run two trains the other will automatically stop in the break run. This train will not be released into the station until the train in front reaches a certain point on the lift hill. Why isnt this type of system on these SROS rides.

As for arrow coasters, you have to maually pull up on the ready break button to let the train in the station if it is stacked. part of the block checks for an arrow ride is to make sure that if you pull up on the ready break release and there is already a train in the station it wont move. The station is considered a block as well as the ready breaks. Only when the station block is clear the ready break button will flash letting you know you can release the train.

Maybe this type of system is better as it requires the operator to be watching as it doesnt just let the next train to come into the station.

But it still boggles me. DID THEY DO A BLOCK CHECK? Thats the reason why you do these things!

Well, I was at SFNE yesterday - in fact, my husband and I had just gotten off the BACK SEAT of the blue train and weren't even at the onride photo station yet when we heard the crash. I can't remember if I was looking at the coaster during the crash, but I remember seeing one of the ride ops, who had been bending over checking seatbelts, either jump or be thrown back (he probably jumped, because he landed on his feet). The blue train jumped up the lift hill about 3-4 cars. Because of how the station is designed we couldn't see the two trains, but another guy who had been behind us getting off the coaster said that the front of the second train was smashed. After the crash we could only see people in the front of the blue train and the end of the red train. They looked stunned, but not injured. Considering that both trains were probably full (approx. 72 people), it's amazing that more people weren't injured.

Park response seemed pretty good, lots of security and police officers and other park personnel appeared within minutes. A small park ambulance responded, and that section of the park was cleared of gawkers (of which there were plenty). Lots of local ambulances appeared (sans lights and sirens) and pulled up behind the ride, so you couldn't really see what was happening. I did hear about 5-6 ambulances hit the sirens briefly as they left the park area.

The headline on one of the local newspapers this morning screamed "SIX FLAGS NIGHTMARE." I figured somebody had been killed - just 21 minor strains, scrapes, bruises, and one broken nose according to the paper.

I know that's not a lot of details, but that's what we saw.

- Rae

when will the ride be open again?

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Paramount Carowinds: Forgotten but not Gone

This was obviously a mechanical failure, I mean you don't purchase a 10 million dollar coaster that exceeds 70 mph and leave it's operation in the hand's of a 17 year old high school kid. This accident is unfortunate especially since a class action lawsuit was just filed against SFNE by the people that nearly drowned on Blizzard River 2 years ago.

This is just a tragic story. I see the coaster being closed for a remainder of the season. Think about it the front of the RED train is pretty much toast, as well as the back of the BLUE. A major inspection is going to take place on both trains and could take quite some time. Since both trains got damaged and a spare is no where to be found (aside from dismantling the RED train and replacing the BLUE rear with the RED train and giving it a fresh coat of paint) I don't think this ride will be operating for a while. As far as my coaster accident knowledge goes.

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BMCOASTER

bmcoaster@wi.rr.com

Why don't we wait for the facts/results of investigation before we make assumptions about the operators, sensors, etc. It's a lot better than playing guessing games.

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Batwing-Bow Down

Do any of you guys think that this will effect the ride's ranking among voters for polls such as IAAPHA (I think that's all the letters) and Amusement Today?

Probably not AT because they just announced the poll...

The local news just reported that Six Flags is trying to open the ride as soon as possible. After they figure out the cause they will fix the problem and reopen the ride.

BB

You certainly have your sympathy for your injuries, but I would like to make 2 technical points.

1) In 1992 when your injuries occurred Darien Lake was not owned by Six Flags. While Six Flags may have acquired the liability when they purchased the park, they were not the operators at the time of the incident.

2) I think that you will agree with me in correcting the statement that "accidents happen". I'm opposed to the term because people take it to mean that accidents cannot be prevented. All accidents have causes. By careful analysis, we can find these causes and correct them, hopefully before the accident occurs.
*** This post was edited by Jim Fisher on 8/7/2001. ***