Why did CCI go out of Buisness?
- More
- 1
- 2 of 2
------------------
Jeff - Webmaster/Admin - CoasterBuzz.com - Sillynonsense.com
DELETED! What time does the water show start?
------------------
"I go out at 3 o' clock for a quart of milk and come home to my son treating his body like an amusement park!" - Estelle Costanza
CCI did NOT make coasters to cheap,just for the record. That is something being pushed as the reason for the close-down (mainly by S&S) to keep the coaster price tags a little higher.
Why did CCI go out of business? For that, follow my logic. CCI built a brand new LARGE building and offices at quite a price tag. The following years saw economic downturn and less projects coming in (only two wooden coasters were built in the states in all of 2002, both by CCI). Now, S&S enters the picture and wants to acquire the company. Bad timing for this as Dinn is now about to enter a divorce proceedings with Larrick. Larrick decides he wants half the value of the company in the divorce (I don't know much about law, but I'm rather certain in the battles of alimony and other such claims, he may have been able to get it). That loss of 1/2 the company's value could very well have closed the company on its own, not to mention the time and legal fees involved.
NOW, we fast forward for a second (I'll explain why in a minute). Money from the IB and Cliff's coasters has been paid to CCI, but much of this money was never received by the 3rd parties Dinn was buying for. A couple of the major loans for the building project (the big new one they had just built) are paid off by Dinn. Then, BOOM, bankruptcy is announced and Dinn is hired by S&S soon thereafter.
I've worked on connecting these dots for a while and all I can sum up is this. SOMEONE, be it a major financial supporter (one who may have helped with the building loan), Dinn's divorce lawyers, or (perhaps) S&S advised Dinn that this was the best course of action. Basically, square this, escape paying Larrick 50% no matter what, and still head the new S&S division. This is that middle section that no one is sure of, but it's blatantly obvious (especially if you know the numbers involved) that the money that was to go to the suppliers for the two coasters went to the loans Dinn did pay off completely (not in installments as most loans are paid).
This was a game, and a play, that I think was just wrong and that's the bottom line. However, it pains me to see the continual claim the CCI charged to little for jobs. That just isn't the case. Dinn made some poor choices at the end based on advice and reasons we'll never know, but the coaster prices were fair and just (in every case I'm aware of).
In addition, an earlier post mentioned a bit about non-payment of bills and the lack of PTC trains being linked. However, as far as I know that is NOT the case. What I understood to be the reasoning for this was as follows: 1) An accident occurred on a CCI coaster in Europe. Ride was either killed or injured (not positive which). 2) CCI insurance company covered the expenses and such as a result. 3) Accident was linked to a fault in the PTC trains, not the coaster itself, so CCI's insurance company went after PTC. Therefore, PTC ceased its dealings with CCI. If someone knows more specifics about this (or, for that matter, if it is false) please post and let me know. That is the tale I've known for some time.
Thanks for listening ... great site by the way, I view often.
------------------
Goccvp1
I was asking myself the same question at CAC. :(
------------------
-Parker
www.SFMWZone.com
RideRideRide said:
In addition, an earlier post mentioned a bit about non-payment of bills and the lack of PTC trains being linked. However, as far as I know that is NOT the case.
It most certainly is the case, and I heard this directly from Tom Rebbie himself. CCI owed PTC tons of money, so PTC refused to continue doing business with CCI until the debts were cleared up. CCI couldn't pay PTC so they went instead to Gerstlauer to supply trains for their coasters. No word on whether or not Gerstlauer was ever paid. Those who wanted a PTC train on their CCI coaster (like Compounce) had to purchase the trains directly from PTC.
*** This post was edited by Jeffrey Seifert 8/25/2003 6:06:03 PM ***
What are the others?
MrScott
Correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't the one S&S woodie to date designed by an Arrow engineer?
If you don't think the company was under-pricing their rides, compare any project of theirs to any GCI and see if you can find the difference in cost. If people knew what LoCoSuMo went for they'd cry, especially considering that was a project that required custom rolling stock and lift mechanisms.
------------------
Jeff - Webmaster/Admin - CoasterBuzz.com - Sillynonsense.com
DELETED! What time does the water show start?
..........hmmm, interesting. I erased my response to this post three times then edited the final version twice; what you say certainly needs to be considered. I find it very hard to believe in the "fatal flaw" scenario as described above; it just doesn't make sense. But then again most people "have it all figured out."
Also, I might add, your identity (or lack thereof) is no one else's business but your own.
------------------
"That's DOCTOR Evil. I didn't spend six years in evil medical school to be called 'Mr. Thank You Very Much.'"
*** This post was edited by ophthodoc 8/25/2003 9:22:37 PM ***
*** This post was edited by ophthodoc 8/25/2003 9:24:32 PM ***
It happened on Port Aventuras STAMPIDA duelling racer. In its first season a person was thrown out of one of the cars and died.
The ride was closed for a the rest of the year and opened a year later with modified restraints.
As far as I know the coaster still runs PTC trains and I didn´t remember any special restraints or seatbelts (my memory might fail me).
rcdb lists Stampida as operating since 1997, but I think the accident happened back in 96 and the ride re-opened in 97.
------------------
YEN! Not ZEN!
------------------
-Parker
www.SFMWZone.com
One random point about ride costs: I remember seeing an article a few years back about Jazzland and the SLC they were getting "this year". The total cost was listed as US$8 million... which itself seemed a wee bit low for a SLC, but pretty close.
The interesting thing was it said Vekoma's cut of it was only $4 million. The other $4 million was for "installation, design work, and park amenities".
50% is a hell of a lot of extra installation cost on top of the cost of the ride itself.
rcdb.com lists the New Mexico Rattler (CCI's last ride) at $2 million, and lists the Ozark Wildcat (CGI's most recent) at $4 million. The specs are pretty comparable, except CCI used a steel structure, which costs more. Or at the other extreme, the single-track-but-earthquake-proof CCI Ghostrider costing more than the twin-track-nowhere-near-a-fault GCI Gwazi.
Who knows what's included in each quote? Ride? Installation? Theming? Extra guys out front selling pelleted ice cream to spread rumors about next year's coaster? I sure don't know... and I sure as hell am not going to pretend I know enough about anyone's balance sheets to even think about taking a side... but hey, maybe it's worth thinking about all the other factors involved in cost.
Back to Jazzland, here's one copy of the article (Google doesn't have a direct deep link to the original): http://groups.yahoo.com/group/RollerCoasterTalk/message/3350?source=1
Also briefly mentioned at http://www.coasterbuzz.com/2003-29-115017.htm
------------------
-Rob
A.C.E. member since 1990
Posting @ Coasterbuzz since 2000
E.C.C. member since 2002
------------------
"That's DOCTOR Evil. I didn't spend six years in evil medical school to be called 'Mr. Thank You Very Much.'"
- More
- 1
- 2 of 2
You must be logged in to post
