UPDATED: Large investors not happy with Six Flags performance

"They said this could involve putting logos, videos and product displays in parks, and issuing Six Flags coupons elsewhere."

And this is different than the way it is now?

What SF needs is some major overhauls in different divisons of Park Operations. Namely more staff training, more security, better maintenance. Most of all SF's bad reputation comes from the park level.

They need to fire a few managers. *cough*SFMM*cough* ;)

Yeah, sticking logos on everything isn't going to help SF. Neither are coupons, they are already giving the house away.

They already have a very high profile marketing campaign with "Mr. Six". If you have a bad product, marketing isn't going to help much. You can't fool people forever.

Yup...I'd say most people are very much aware of their local park. Give them a good product. Duh!

Dan Snyder made some extra money when he decided to start charging for pre-season games...is it possible that SF will now have a *pre-season*, where only the SCRUB rides will be open after the first quarter? ;)

I can see it now, Acrophobia runs until noon, at which time we're stuck with only the first-gen drop ride, a third-string ride at best....ROFL!

Well.... Isn't the Six Flags Boardroom getting interesting. If only they would have done this a year ago things might have been a little different this year. Anyone else want to become a fly on the wall?

Does anyone think 9/11 is still affecting park attendance?

No.

Nor do I think it ever affected local parks...

Anyway, I think you'd need to have more than an 8% stake to get any real change going. Then again, I suppose he could rally the troops...that is if the troops honestly believe that more advertising will do the trick.

This could mean three things; Either SF shapes up and try to resolve their major issues (Customer Service, Ride Ops/Capacity and Quality Attractions/Rides-especially in the smaller parks) or Mr Snyder will just get a majority stake and sell the company to the highest bidder or Mr Gates will cut his losses and sell their shares, possibly leading to SF's demise. I agree with evry1 that marketing a bad product would not really work. What Mr Snyder proposes to do more of to boost revenues, is already in place, and has produced lackluster results. Its all about people and product. SFMM rivals Cedar Point in ride quality, but OMG, they have the worst capacity/operations issues anyone could imagine. Their rides is their only saving grace, tht's why people still come back. And in response to Vernon's post, 9/11's impact should be minimal because Florida and Las Vegas has reported increased attendance, not to mention Paramount Parks reported increased revenues. I hope Cedar Fair takes em over!

I look at it a different way janfrederick. Cascade Investments and Red Zone now own close to 20% of the stock. Both are screaming for better performance.

I guess the fence around Superman is really for safety after all. Dan Snyders safety so he doesn't get hit when he gets off his helicopter when it lands at SFA.

Not to be a smart ass here as I assume there were some simple mental/typing errors...

Snyder did NOT start the practice of charging for pre-season games. This practice has been around for years by ALL teams and certainly predated Snyder. He did, however, start charging for training camp. Most training camps are free. A few now charge money after Snyder's lead. This was seen as a pretty cheap and crappy thing to do at the time (a few years ago) by most football fans as I recall.

Also, "Gibbs" did not hire Spurrier. Snyder did!

Furthermore, does any of this matter? All self-respecting football fans prefer the Cleveland Browns---don't they? :-)

As I said, I assume these were simple misspeaks. I just wanted to correct the record.

Oh yea! In my opinion, the lord himself would have trouble turning Six Flags around short term. I think it is at least 5 years away, and a few parks sold, from profitability.

Continue on...

maybe they will give out free microsft stuff
or the a steel sitdown called the windows crash
i dunno it would be cool

tick tick tick
times a ticking until rt3
:)

You know, the marketing is actually the one thing Six Flags has gotten right this year.

Well a coaster is a coaster, depending on what you like. But the experience is what really matters. The SF experience is not that great, I have been to 4 or 5 parks and they are lackluster. I worked at one also, and wasn't impressed.

Would NOW be a good time to buy PKS?

Here's the comment that bothers me:

---

"Management has failed to implement measures to increase revenues and decrease expenses, and its failure to do so has caused the company to be continuously outperformed by its peers"

---

I'm sorry, but has anybody been watching what PKS has been doing? It's the whole mentality that is wrong, and that statement from Snyder's filing suggests that he is no different from what we've been seeing at Six Flags for years: $12 parking, $3.50 Coke, and so on down the line, meanwhile budgets slashed for crews, maintenance, training, equipment.....aren't those the obvious ways to increase revenue and decrease expenses?

I swear, as long as every price tag is called "revenue" and every investment is called "expense," Six Flags is going to go further and further down the donniker and there is nothing that will save them. Giving away the gate, then actively pissing off your customers once they're inside (through broken down rides, insane dings, inefficient operations, general filth, and rotten customer service) is no way to increase revenue. Slashing the maintenance and operations budget so that the parks can't deliver the kind of customer service that WILL increase revenue is no way to cut expenses. Getting away from the raw bean counting is probably the first thing that Six Flags *needs* to do. Unfortunately, with their finances in their present shape, it's probably the last thing they *will* do.

And next time Will Koch gives an online seminar or Amusement Business interview and explains how he runs his park, perhaps the Six Flags people ought to listen seriously for a change.

--Dave Althoff, Jr.

"You know, the marketing is actually the one thing Six Flags has gotten right this year".

Haven't you heard? Mr Six has already packed up and moved back to Florida. ;)

Jeffrey R Smith corrected me: "Snyder did NOT start the practice of charging for pre-season games. This practice has been around for years by ALL teams and certainly predated Snyder. He did, however, start charging for training camp."

My bad on that one. We were in DC for a conference when he announced this new policy, and I remember the locals were OUTRAGED. Never having been to an NFL preseason game OR training camp, I confused the two.

Dave commented: "And next time Will Koch gives an online seminar or Amusement Business interview and explains how he runs his park, perhaps the Six Flags people ought to listen seriously for a change."

I listened, *intently*. While Will had MANY good things to say about the industry, the one thing that STUCK with me was his opinion that GUESTS not only pay for admission with their *hard-earned cash*, they ALSO pay a price that no one else seems to understand....their VALUABLE free time. When I hear of the operations policies at MANY parks (my local Busch park included), I don't think many people in the industry understand that WE patrons do indeed value that *most precious commodity*.

25% jump in share price overnight...the markets are listening, is SFI corporate?

I think Dave hit the nail on the head. And I don't see Snyder's idea's as benefitting the company.

Bill Gates on the other hand can apply some of his tactics successfully. They already own a large percentage of the market, so now go after the lifeblood of the park experience and buy up most of the quality ride manufacturers and only produce quality rides for SF. Can't you just see it...SF owning B&M, Intamin, GCI, Huss and a few others, so that Paramount, Busch, and others will be limited to company like Vekoma..LOL

Seriously though...Jeffery..Any self-respecting football fan wants nothing to do with the Browns. Maybe the Chargers or the Cardinals, but not the Browns ;-)

Sean