Six Flags charts course, but skies aren't clear yet

^^^I would disagree with you saying that there are no successful amusement parks that charge cheaper. Why in the heck are all those PA parks still running? Why aren't they aren't out of business yet? Why is Kiddieland still in business charging only around $20. How in the heck is Santa's Village still open in New Hampshire charging $20?

These parks can get away with these prices because they are NOT adding million and millions of dollars each year.

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P18:
If a burger and side of fries fills me up, I could get filled for $30 bucks, or get filled for $15 bucks, theres no "buying extra I don't need"...

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But that's not what you said earlier. What you said earlier was:

"I tend to buy more food when its cheaper just because it's cheaper..."

There's a big difference in those two quotes. So which is it?

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RGB:
But which pricing are we talking about-- the $15 parking and $4 soda pricing? Or the season pass for the same cost as a single day admission pricing? And if they're not sure about they're pricing, how can they be sure of what kind of experience they will, or will be able to, provide?

Gonch, it seems that Shapiro himself isn't sure of your economic model.

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Nah, the article answers all of that. Prices in the park are still of the $15/$4 variety. The season pass thing is the stupidness no one seemed to understand...until now. Just read the next-to-last paragraph of the article - there's your answer. For whatever reason, Shapiro feels he needs to show some attendance numbers and that he needs to show them now.

The fact that in-park pricing remains shows he believes. But his back is to the wall and he has people to answer to. Those people expect to see some upward trending attendance numbers.

Those people are also idiots. :)

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Spinout:
Why is Kiddieland still in business charging only around $20. How in the heck is Santa's Village still open in New Hampshire charging $20?

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The very fact that you're comparing Kiddieland and Santa's Village to big regional themers for your argument is cause for alarm.

These parks can get away with these prices because they are NOT adding million and millions of dollars each year.

^I would argue that they operate on the "less, cheaper is better" model. And if *I* were the one opening a NEW park on a budget (say, completely unlike HRP or IoA) - then I'd have to go in with the knowledge and understanding of the LOCAL market, and how best to serve it. Frankly (and sadly), those parks, like WWW tried to do, are VERY hard to get off the ground these days...

Please understand that MY personal favorite parks, like KW, IB, HW, Silverwood, Idlewild, etc. are places that I hold in ultimate regard. But where Gonch has a very valid point is that those parks are budget-conscious about their own expenditures, and I'd have to argue that the very REASON they're successful is that they've all grown up quite gradually and with an in-depth knowledge of their particular demographics.

Six Flags, Paramount, CF - they work (or don't, LOL) on the basis of continual larger-scale expansions, with an eye toward attracting ALL of the people within their respective regions.

^^LOL, once again the master beats the student to the punch... ;)

Heh. But the kicker is that you took the time to explain things while I wrote it off with a smart-ass, single-line comment.

Tack your comments onto the end of mine (well, they kind of are) and you have a complete post.

A case of the student exceeding the master? :)

But it's then based on the assumption that season passes will result in multiple visits with the same or higher per cap.

Look at it this way-- based on the $40 per cap that gets tossed about, your prototypical family of 4 spends around $160 per visit. If for some reason, they visit 5 times, the stats say they'd spend an average of $800 for the season. If the chain wants to raise its per cap by 10% ($4), that total becomes $880.

If this same family buys 4 of these SPs for $50 each (looking at the cheapest rate I've seen), they spend a total or $200 (give or take a few cents). If they only visit once, the company is way ahead. If they visit twice, they'd have to spend an extra $120 between the two trips to meet the "average." (8 heads @ $40 each, less the 200 spent on passes). That's only around $15 per person per trip. The company still likely comes out ahead with food, parking, etc.

But if they visit 5 times during the season, they'd have to spend $600-680, or $120-136 inside the gate each visit to support the present or raised per cap. Even counting the parking charge and $4 a soda, that's a lot of in park spending-- a lot more than is happening in any non-Disney park now.

Maybe people will think SF gave away the gate only to bend them over inside the park. In that case, they won't be back, and the company makes out. But they won't get the attendance folks here seem to think they're aiming for. If they get the increased attendance, it's no shoo-in they'll get a corresponding increase in revenue.

Some people might be impressed by a 200, 300, or even 500K increase in attendance. But if it's accompanied by flat revenues, the people holding the IOUs won't be overwhelmed.

Even if theme park admission prices are undervalued, as Lord Gonchar speculates, it would be foolish to ignore the effect the cost of living increases are having.

More and more people are seeing their discretionary income eaten up by hight gas prices, high food prices and other essentials that are priced higher. So what if theme parks are a good value, and even under priced? If people do not have the available cash to go, attendance will suffer regardless of the value of the price of admission.

A theme park visit is not as affordable to the average middle class family not because a theme park visit is a poor value, but because they do not have the money to blow on a visit after life's essentials are taken care of.

I really think increasing prices to offset attendance shortfalls is a death spiral that cannot continue to happen for much longer.

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RGB:
Some people might be impressed by a 200, 300, or even 500K increase in attendance. But if it's accompanied by flat revenues, the people holding the IOUs won't be overwhelmed.

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That's the way I sees it. :)

Hey, I'm on the "the cheap passes are dumb" side here. An artifical attendance boost based on 'giveaway' pass prices doesn't help anyone. It just makes it harder next year. If I have to concede something t still seem pro-SF in this one, then I suppose buying time is better than nothing...mostly because that's the one thing Shapiro needs and doesn't have.

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Pete:
A theme park visit is not as affordable to the average middle class family not because a theme park visit is a poor value, but because they do not have the money to blow on a visit after life's essentials are taken care of.

I really think increasing prices to offset attendance shortfalls is a death spiral that cannot continue to happen for much longer.

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I think you underestimate the public's ability to spend.

Perhaps I overestimate it, but I base my guess on what I see around me - and if actions speak louder than words, then people either can, will or will find a way to spend.

Offering a discounted season pass has brought some of us back. Just this morining while looking at drawings of DarkNight, my best friend asked me, "Do you really care about that ride?" This surprised me, because I do, anything new is better then nothing. Other people just have lost faith in Six Flags. Pricing must be changed at the gate and at food venues. Quality must be brought back or people will keep buying food outside the park. Christmans spending was down from expectations. Money is getting harder to come by. Gas prices are all over the place and that drives most peoples spending habits. I want this to be a great year but it's going to take hard work convincing people how to spend money.

Unless of course, something new replaces something better, in which case nothing added would have been better. Wiggles stage for a classic arrow hydro-flume, for example, or an indoor mouse with stunts in place of two custom launch racing coasters and a Hopkins chutes ride