Seatbelts, What is really necessary?

^^The new cages (they have Z's on them) have a double lock. They close it, and it can't come open. They have a safety pin also, I believe. The old ones only have the safety pin. The whole thing is that, that thing can't come open with the safety pin in there. It just wouldn't happen.

It's the carnival workers fault if they don't insert the safety pin in. The thing just can't come open if they insert it in.

Ok so some of you are saying that you dont think Top Gun (KI) or Iron Dragon should have seat belts, but why should they have seat belts less then the other arrow rides like Corckscrew or Vortex? The restraint system is the same to me, and regardless of where the track is, if you need a secondary restraint on one, you need it on the other.

And if it is something that is done to help with insurance, or requested by lawyers, why isn't it on everything? halltd brought up a good point. The B&M Hypers don't have any seat belts. Granted its a completely different restraint system, but why do they put them on all their other coasters, and not on those. Didn't Nitro used to have seat belts? What about B&M flyers? Should they be using seat belts as well? I know that the vest is a seatbelt, but should the restraint open, thats not going to serve the secondary seatbelt position.

So the seat belts may be useful, they may just be there to help with the feel of safety in the eyes of the guest or to satisfy insurance/lawyers. Whatever it is shouldn't it be consistent through out the industry? or at least shouldn't it be consistent throughout a chain? or at the very least shouldn't it be consistant throughout a park?

Half the time a Seatbelt is nothing more than a body size limiter. The other half is a extra hurdle to keep someone from doing something stupid.

They're worthless in about 80 percent of the coasters and rides out there and if you haven't noticed. Most scramblers have them now.

Chuck

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IntaminHater said:

The B&M Hypers don't have any seat belts. Granted its a completely different restraint system, but why do they put them on all their other coasters, and not on those. Didn't Nitro used to have seat belts?

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Nitro used to have seatbelts:

http://www.coastergallery.com/1999/GA67.html

But it was a different kind that appears to have latched onto the clamshell rather than go over the rider.

I'll admit I was a little nervous the first time I rode Nitro because of the lack of a seatbelt. I trust B&M more than any other coaster company but was still nervous.

Iron Dragon doesn't need seatbelts because it's almost impossible to fall out of that thing even if the restraint failed. Corkscrew goes upside down, so if the restraint were to fail, an occupant could potentially fall out. The same applies to a lot of other rides.

Many of you claim the seat belts are used to eject people that are too big. In the case of MF, sure that's true. But, that's not WHY the seatbelt is there. It's still there to hold you in if the lap bar were to open.

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halltd said:
Iron Dragon doesn't need seatbelts because it's almost impossible to fall out of that thing even if the restraint failed. Corkscrew goes upside down, so if the restraint were to fail, an occupant could potentially fall out. The same applies to a lot of other rides.

Many of you claim the seat belts are used to eject people that are too big. In the case of MF, sure that's true. But, that's not WHY the seatbelt is there. It's still there to hold you in if the lap bar were to open.

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The seat belts on Intamin Hypers were added after the first Superman Ejection at Darien Lake They were not on them originally. That guy wasn't killed.

They are a maximum size measuring device and if that weren't the case, they wouldn't make you have to get a extra inch. The belts would owrk either way.

Chuck

Is it possible that parks get a discount from there insurance company if they install them?

It's possible the insurance companies won't insure them unless they have them.

Chuck

If it is a size device why cant they use things like the red line on B&M Hypers. Or the green/red lines and yellow arrow indicator they used to use on the shoulder restraints on drop rides. Again if the insurance companies wont issue insurance if the rides don't have seat belts, why are the seat belts not more standard with all the coasters?

I don't know about you, but i feel 10x safer with the seatbelts than without them...especially on looping coasters. I always had uneasy feelings when riding Double Loop or Mind Eraser because I hate how all of your weight relys on this little 5lb restraint...with the seatbelts...I feel much safer.

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Charles Nungester said:
The seat belts on Intamin Hypers were added after the first Superman Ejection at Darien Lake They were not on them originally. That guy wasn't killed.

They are a maximum size measuring device and if that weren't the case, they wouldn't make you have to get a extra inch.

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Well, if seat belts were installed, maybe that rider wouldn't have been ejected?

Regardless, the seat belts on MF are used for sizing, i agree. But, I've not seen this in effect on any other Intamin. Ride of Steel at SFNE (where someone DID die from being ejected) has monstrous seat belts. Some aren't even Intamin double locking seat belts. They're standard airplane seat belts. There are no yellow lines on these belts.

Even the belts on El Toro are really long. Do they have yellow marks on them? Yes. But, that's no different than a safety bar having a line on it like B&M hypers. If you're too big, you can't ride. I think you see the yellow stitching on seat belts because it's easier and cheaper than putting in "go/no go" lap bars.

Is that WHY seat belts exist on coasters? No. They're to keep people in the seats, not on the ground.

So halltd (Tim), I never knew you were a ride designer.

Wooden Coasters dont need seatbelts? I disagree, PTC individual lap bars do not suit me well at all, and thanks to my long, big legs the bar is not close enough to my lap. If it weren't for the belts airtime would move me around way too much, perhaps even to the point of ejecting me from the ride. Now the old one position full bench bars they hold me in much better, but the newer models I wouldn't dream of riding a coaster with any sort of airtime with out them.

^^ I said I was a ride designer where?

All three Superman: Ride of Steel coasters had go/no go seatbelts installed after the original seatbelts failed to perform that task. A simple yellow line doesn't work so well on a lapbar with an infinite number of locking positions.

-Nate

The newer intamins and the Superman ride of steels (installed after SFNE) have limit switches in the lapbars, if the computer doesn't see the bar down far enough the train is not allowed to dispatch.

^^ Ride of Steel at SF New England does NOT have go/no go seat belts. I was just there and paid particular attention to the restraints and seat belts.

Xcelerator has go/no go devices on the t-bar. It's a little red and green ball that rotates like a gyroscope. If the little window is red, you don't ride. If you can lower the bar enough to completely show green, you can ride.

I thought Six Flags installed go/no go seatbelts (belts that attached to the lapbar) after the SFNE incident. I am positive there was some sort of go/no go system installed, but I could be mistaken in thinking it was a seatbelt. I have not been there since.

The regular seatbelts also act as a go/no go system, and that comes directly from Six Flags.

-Nate *** Edited 7/24/2007 3:34:15 PM UTC by coasterdude318***

There is a go/no Go on SF and now (Darien's) S:ROS plus a seatbelt. The no go belt has to attach to the bar or your too big.

Chuck

However, SFA's SROS no longer has the go/no go seat belt that attached to the lap bar. They initially had it after the major modification, but they have since removed it.

Why they removed the original style seat belt, I'm not sure--unless it was deemed unsafe because of the SFNE incident. Personally, I liked these belts better.