Relationship between B+M and Six Flags?

Tuesday, December 31, 2002 1:45 PM

Do coaster companies and theme park companies have relationships or partnerships? I am wondering why B+M has built many coasters for six flags and only 2 for cedar fair and extremelly few for paramount. It also seems like many more intamins are at cedar fair parks than at six flags. Is this just because some companies work better together? Just food for thought.

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Tuesday, December 31, 2002 1:52 PM
Three B&Ms at Cedar Fair- Raptor, Mantis, and Talon.

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- John
Dag, yo
Support Rob in the Great DDR Challenge!

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Tuesday, December 31, 2002 2:04 PM
There are a lot of Intamins @ SF parks...probably more then CF

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Tuesday, December 31, 2002 2:15 PM

vipergoliath said:

I am wondering why B+M has built many coasters for six flags and only 2 for cedar fair and extremelly few for paramount.


Becuase Six Flags has gone to B&M for coasters more than the other parks mentioned. I'm not sure there's really any mystery or "relationships" about it. Coasters cost money and they're used to make money for the park purchasing it. You (as a park manager) decide what makes the most sense for you. Six Flags seemed to think that was B&M more in the past than the other parks mentioned.

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www.coasterimage.com

*** This post was edited by Lord Gonchar on 12/31/2002. ***

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Tuesday, December 31, 2002 2:34 PM
There's also the fact that there are around 40 Six Flags parks while there are 5 Paramount parks and 5 'large' Cedar Fair parks...

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Jonathan Hawkins
Starcoasters.com
"There is a cluster of bees at the top of the lift. Sorry for the inconvenience."

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Tuesday, December 31, 2002 2:39 PM
I think if you took ratios into consideration, you would think different.

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Tuesday, December 31, 2002 3:01 PM

StarCoasters said:
"There's also the fact that there are around 40 Six Flags parks while there are 5 Paramount parks and 5 'large' Cedar Fair parks...

This guy has got it right. But yikes! That's still a lot of Six Flags beemers!

- Batman The Ride, SFGAm
- Batman The Ride, SFNJ
- Batman The Ride, SFMM
- Batman The Ride, SFoG
- Batman The Ride, SFStL
- Batman The Ride, SFoT
- (Batman The Ride, SFNO)
- (Batman la Fuga)
- Iron Wolf
- Chang
- The Riddler's Revenge
- Raging Bull
- Medusa, SFNJ
- Medusa, SFMW
- The Georgia Scorcher
- Superman Krypton Coaster
- Nitro
- Batman Knight Flight
- Batman The Dark Knight
- Superman Ultimate Flight, SFOG
- Superman Ultimate Flight, SFGAm
- Superman Ultimate Flight, SFNJ
- Scream!
- (Superman la Atracción de Acero)

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Wednesday, January 1, 2003 9:13 AM
NO, there are not relationships between parks and companies. Whoever has money can contract a ride from any of the companies they choose. There are not "pacts" or "alliances" with different coaster companies and different park chains. They are a business out to make money and whoever has it gets what they can afford.

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'out the 100Base-T, through the router, down the OC3, over the leased line, off the bridge, past the firewall......nothin' but Net.

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Wednesday, January 1, 2003 9:23 AM
It's all based one if they want a beemer, intamin, vekoma (gulp), or any other coaster. If Cedar Fair wanted 6 beemers for each park, they would go to them. It's not like B&M goes to SF and is like 'I'm manufacturing a coaster right now, if you want it, i will let you have first dibs.' It's who has money, and then who they contact.

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Shaun Rajewski
Rctycoon2k
http://www.rctycoon2k.com
"a recently crowned person in the 'know'"

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Wednesday, January 1, 2003 9:43 AM
Usually most Six Flags parks is the ones with the money, space, and want B&M because of the good capacity, and reliability. Six flags usually have large crowds so B&M delivers eye catching coasters, not too intense, its good for a large age group, and larger variety of designs.
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Wednesday, January 1, 2003 10:26 AM

It's more like this...B&Ms usually cost somewhere between $12-14 million and a bottom-line oriented (read: profitable) chain like CF is only going to install them at parks with sufficient attendance to support them.

Besides, there's a lot of other things you could to with that kind of money. CF seems perfectly happy with Intamin's work these days.

-'Playa

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The CPlaya 100--6 days, 9 parks, 47 coasters, 2037 miles and a winner.....LoCoSuMo.

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Wednesday, January 1, 2003 11:31 AM

Yeah, only KBF, Cedar Point, Dorney, and in some ways valleyfair can recover the cost of building a huge Intamin or B&M since they are the parks that pull in the big bucks with things like seperate admission waterparks (there are 3 branded under the knotts name aand controlled by Falas in the so. cal area), hotels, large resturants (the chicken dinner resturant feeds almost 10,000 people on busy days at about $14 a person for the 6 course dinner), and halloween events. Its obvious these days that CF prefers working with Intamin (the whole no relationship theory is crap). Look at all the rides built in the past few years (since like 2000): perilous plunge, xcelerator, dragster, steel venom, wicked twister, and millenium force. Now, they only built what, 1 B&M during the same period (talon). it has not too much to do with cost (Intamins are a few million less expensive for something about 3/5 as short- and even a CCI can cost 24 million to built-Ghostrider) as much as it has to do with satisfaction with intamins products. The GP loves them (arguably more than B&M- I don't see all that many guests clapping and cheering after their ride on Riddlers revenge-just silence), and they're cheap to maintain. Cedar Fair and S&S now also have a little relationship, which did get a little shattered a few months ago with vertigo.

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Wednesday, January 1, 2003 1:00 PM

It's not like B&M goes to SF and is like 'I'm manufacturing a coaster right now, if you want it, i will let you have first dibs.' It's who has money, and then who they contact.


I didn't know you were a spokesperson for B&M and Six Flags! Actually, that has happened, it was with the floorless prototype (which was slated for another park), not really a specific coaster.

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Wednesday, January 1, 2003 1:08 PM
That just made me think: How many Intamins does SF have? Off the top of my head I can only think of a few.

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"I never apologize. I'm sorry but that's just the way I am." -Homer Simpson

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Wednesday, January 1, 2003 1:23 PM
CF went to B&M about MF, and they said NO.
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Wednesday, January 1, 2003 1:54 PM

Remember that most Space Spirals/Towers are Intamins, most River Rapids rides (and other water rides) are Intamin creations as well. Intamin designs woodies, and let us not forget Impulses. Oh and the drop rides too! I think many people are just being deceived by the last 3 consecutive coasters at CP being Intamin. See the Intamin Website to see all the stuff they create.

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Wednesday, January 1, 2003 2:16 PM
GP does like B&M's Incredible Hulk is the worlds most beloved coaster, hence why the GP voted it number 1. Batman models are also extremtly popular, and Top Gun at PGA and Medusa at SFMW are norcal's favorite rides.

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2002, PGA,SFMW,MK,MGM,AK, EPCOT,IOA, UNIVERSAL, SWO,and SFMM!
2003,?

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Wednesday, January 1, 2003 2:48 PM

I imagine it works similar to buying an item of clothing at a shop. Lets say I choose store X and buy a t-shirt, I wear the t-shirt and then decide I want another one. Since I was happy with my first t-shirt I will probably go back to store X to buy another. Many shirts down the line I am still happy with store X but I could see what I want in store Y and maybe it is cheaper so I purchase from there. It doesn't mean i don't like store X or stop me from buying at store X in the future.

Many parks work with the same manufacturer many times because they are happy with the rides they have had in the past and therefore feel they will be happy with the new ride. Drayton Manor has used Intamin many times recently. There is no behind thescenes deal but they have been happy with the rides they have bought and should Intamin be offering what they want they would probably get it from them but it is by no means exclusive.

Tussaud's have bought five B&M's because they obviously like the quality of their attractions.It didn't sop them buying an Intamin for Thorpe when B&M didn't offer what they wanted however they plummed for B&M for the Inverter.

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Wednesday, January 1, 2003 4:55 PM

Yeah, Intamin is BY FAR more diversified than B&M. Ferris Wheels with freefalls and coaster track incorporated into them (like the sun wheel at DCA, with a freefall somehow incorporated), tower rides, dark rides like Indiana Jones (where do you think all that Technology that WDI claims they came up with really came from), water rides like Perilous Plunge, raft rides like Grizzly River Run (first to have a spinning drop), simulators like back to the future, what Intamin calls Multi Media Dark Rides, which look an awful lot like the Amazing adventures of spiderman (these rides and Indiana Jones rides must pull in a fortune for Intamin they cost 200 million sometimes), about 7 kinds of observation or parachute towers, about 6 flat rides, LIM rides, hydraulic launches, wooden coasters, and their famous hypers and gigas. Inverts too.

If the amusement industry goes into a recession, Intamin could always make monorails for cities, they make those too.

Now B&M. You can count their different kinds of rides on one hand. Sitdown (floorless or standard), standup, invert, flying, and their hypers. If a really big accident occurs on one of their rides (much more than say the Perilous Plunge accident), who knows what will happen to their company.

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Thursday, January 2, 2003 8:57 AM

Six Flags Owned Intamins

1. V2(SFGAM) 2. American Eagle(SFGAM) 3. Superman(SFA) 4. Superman(SFNE) 5. Superman(SFDL) 6. Batman: The Escape(SFAW, Designed by B&M while they worked at Intamin, very similar to Iron Wolf) Skull Mountain(SFGADV) 7. Flashback(SFMM) 8. Superman: The Escape(SFMM) 9. V2(SFMW) 10. La Vibora(SFOT) 11. Superman: Ultimate Escape(SFWOA) 12. Goliath(SFH)

Cedar Fair Owned Intamins

1.Steel Venom(VF) 2. Xcelerator(KBF) 3. Unknown(CP) 4. Wicked Twister(CP) 5. Millennium Force(CP) 6. Jr. Gemini(CP) 7. Disaster Transport(CP)

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