Referring to the "batwing accident"

Friday, September 20, 2002 12:20 PM
Someone posted about that batwing accident and i have the link. You'll probably close it but for anyone wondering, here it is. http://www.newsline.umd.edu/justice/killercoasters050202.htm

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Formerly known as Glenn on Coasterbuzz.
Check out http://www.ckportal.zzn.com

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Friday, September 20, 2002 12:25 PM
You have to wonder why a segment of the public is so fixated on the "dangers" of amusement rides when, all told, the number of deaths in any way related to those rides during the past 100 years is such a small fraction of the number of highway fatalities in any given month.
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Friday, September 20, 2002 12:30 PM

Plus the given fact that it happened LAST September... why are they bringing it up now, all of a sudden?

It's like they're trying to spark contraversy or something. I mean, we've already had a crap-load of this "pre-existing condition" junk from the lady at Knotts among many others... why bring up more now?

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Friday, September 20, 2002 12:33 PM
I love that URL....killercoasters. That will really make people want to flock to amusement parks!

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Formerly known as Glenn on Coasterbuzz.
Check out http://www.ckportal.zzn.com

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Friday, September 20, 2002 12:57 PM

"Several new rides pull 6.5 g".....now, not necessarily doubting them, but Taz is the only coaster to pull 6.5 that I know of, and it's not new and IS still SBNO. I think Mindbender at WEM pulled 6.2.....

Every new ride that I'm aware of pulls less than 5.....and the highest g-force attained isn't really that important anyway, the DURATION is.....which is why Goliath still ranks SO high in my esteem....

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Friday, September 20, 2002 1:11 PM
The article stated that some rides pull 6.5 G's and astronauts only pull 4. What they did not state was the fact that coaster riders only experience the G's for a few seconds, whereas astronauts experience them for several minutes.

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The worst day at Cedar Point is better than the best day at work.

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Friday, September 20, 2002 1:11 PM
The main issue is not Batwing. It's that she had Marfan syndrome. I have Marfan syndrome and it is really no big deal -- as long as you don't have the heart trouble associated with it and thank God I do not. She would have died soon anyway if she wasn't aware that she had it.
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Friday, September 20, 2002 1:44 PM

The victim in this incident was aware of her heart condition and chose to ride anyway. (Not my speculation, this was confirmed by 2 sources.) She took a risk and unfortunately it didn't work out for her. People with many medical conditions have to decide what risks to take. The choice is often between risking death and not living life. The trick is to make reasonable choices. I don't know enough about the victem's details of her medical condition to know if the risk she took was reasonable or unreasonable. Of course what is reasonable and unreasonable depends on your own values to some extent.

This was not the only case of a death related to heart failure on a coaster last year. I know of at least one other case, and there were probably more. There were also cases of death to people who just walked the midways. With an attendance of 300 million people at parks, some people are going to die of medical conditions.

Those who have ridden Batwing or X-Flight know that these are not coasters that are particularly stressful physically. How soon the young lady involved would have died if she had chosen to not ride and to avoid all other stress is probably impossible to say.

I don't see this kind of death as an issue in amusement park safety. If anything it is an issue in the philosophy of how people with medical conditions are going to approach life.

As to the linked article, it is a good example of bad journalism. Besides its obvious muck raking, one sided approach, it is poorly researched and written.

*** This post was edited by Jim Fisher on 9/20/2002. ***

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Friday, September 20, 2002 2:54 PM

I like the writing style of the college kid who wrote it.

"All the facts say my POV is wrong. So does every expert involved. But I think that somehow, someway I'm right."

A thinking person would say okayyyyyy....

The staff of any of a half-dozen tabloid TV shows would say, "Great work! You're hired!"

-'Playa

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The CPlaya 100--6 days, 9 parks, 47 coasters, 2037 miles and a winner.....LoCoSuMo.

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Friday, September 20, 2002 2:56 PM

I hate the fact how they still use:

"Several new coasters boast top speeds of 100 mph and hold G-force ratings -- a measure of the amount of acceleration force exerted on a body -- at 6.5, more than the maximum 4 G's that astronauts feel while traveling up to 17,440 mph on liftoff, according to a 2002 article in the Annals of Emergency Medicine."

But they never bother to point out that astronauts are put through 4 G's during the greater part of the shuttle lift off and flight, while coasters that pull more than 6 G's (one that I can think of...) hold it for less than a second. That is a big difference, although one could argue that the two situations are not really comparable due to the significant differences.

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-Robert Alland

*** This post was edited by RCForeman on 9/20/2002. ***

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Friday, September 20, 2002 3:02 PM

There are a lot of exaggerated points in that article. Only 3 rides reach speeds of 100 mph and up, and hardly any get as high as 6.5 Gs. And they ALWAYS use that damn astronaut comparison. Astronauts experience 4 Gs for about 5 minutes while roller coasters do 3 - 5 Gs in a fraction of a second.

Damn media.

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Friday, September 20, 2002 3:16 PM
They also downplay the fact that she rode knowing she had a VERY serious medical condition. If she knew she had Marfan syndrome, I guarantee you she had an ultrasound that confirmed she had an aortic dissection. If she rode, that's her problem. I feel sorry for her, but if she did know she had Marfan's, you gotta wonder what she thought.
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Friday, September 20, 2002 3:29 PM

I posted the news regarding last year's accident on Batwing this morning but the topic was closed rather quickly.

I'm surprised that a full year has passed and we are just learning about this because I don't recall anything being mentioned about it last year when it happened and like I said in the original topic I was quite sad to learn that a fatal mishap had occured at the park and it could've been avoided had she not been on the ride at all,when I read the original information while surfing the web this morning I thought it was a more recent accident,of course I would've posted a direct link but have no experience doing so in the forums,I'm only familiar with posting links via instant messenger.

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Friday, September 20, 2002 3:47 PM
Well I say instead of sitting around letting the media make our beloved hobby sound more and more like a nightmare. We need to use our voice to putt out the truth, There are millions of us in this word I sure we'll be heard. Calling all Enthusiaust, Web masters, Designers/maunfacturers, GMs of these parks, and even the coaster loving GP we have got to educate these people and quick be it's too late.

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Wir schrauben für Euch die Achterbahn zusammen!!!

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Friday, September 20, 2002 4:42 PM
I'm surprised that the park hasn't been sued at all for what happened,I'd hate to see it go that far.
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Friday, September 20, 2002 6:07 PM

A law suit would have no merit at all.

I first heard of this incident shortly after it happened. The newspaper article linked above was from May. Not much has been made of the incident since while personally tragic it simply isn't newsworthy. People die all the time at parks due to medical conditions. Most of them while walking down the midway, waiting in line, eating, or watching a show. People also die at malls and in groceries. People dying due to natural causes just isn't news unless the people are famous.

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Friday, September 20, 2002 6:37 PM

kRaXLeRidAh said:

There are a lot of exaggerated points in that article. Only 3 rides reach speeds of 100 mph and up, and hardly any get as high as 6.5 Gs. And they ALWAYS use that damn astronaut comparison. Astronauts experience 4 Gs for about 5 minutes while roller coasters do 3 - 5 Gs in a fraction of a second.

Damn media.



Good points. Your body can also experiance up to 10 Gs from sitting down too quickly. Next thing you know, they will have laws in Jersey stating how fast you are allowed to sit in public. This story is traggic though and I'm glad it wasn't a major headline for the familys sake.

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Friday, September 20, 2002 6:53 PM

The result is mixed regulation in most states and no government regulation of permanent amusement parks in states like Alabama, Mississippi, Kansas, Utah, Arizona, Montana, North Dakota and South Dakota.

According to the RCDB, Montana, North Dakota, and south Dakota don't even HAVE any roller coasters!

*** This post was edited by (SF)Great American on 9/20/2002. ***

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