# Raging Bull

Tuesday, January 8, 2002 10:44 AM
From what I have read about trim brakes is that if the coaster is going too fast in a certain part of the track, that it is engaged by sensors to apply a certain amount of pressure to slow down.  Since the ride can be travelling at different speeds based on the weight inside the ride, the amount of braking would be different for each train passing by.  My guess is that if that trim werent there, a train going over that hill might be subject to some painful ejector air which the general public would complain about especially with the restraint system used on the ride which gives a great sensation of airtime.

I always ride this ride in the back so I am already flying over that hill to notice to much speed reduction and still get some marvelous air.  IMHO, the back is the ONLY place to ride this coaster.  I also love the wicked air coming over that first hill.  WOOHOO!

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Bob Hansen

"Excuse me while I kick the sky!"
kickthesky@hotmail.com

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Tuesday, January 8, 2002 11:30 AM
Why does everyone think weight makes a difference? On a full circuit gravity coaster like this is makes no difference, on a launched coaster it does.
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Does CCI know how to make a bad coaster?
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Tuesday, January 8, 2002 12:46 PM
MagnumForce, it does too. More weight (technically the term that should be used is mass) the more inertia. This will keep the train traveling at a faster rate, so the trims will need to be used more.
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I have no signature.
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Tuesday, January 8, 2002 1:44 PM
Not faster, just farther, gravity pulls on everything the same in free fall it is the same, with more mass the speeds are not any faster, but the train has more inertia meaning it takes longer to stop.  It has no difference in speed.

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Does CCI know how to make a bad coaster?

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Tuesday, January 8, 2002 2:03 PM
Oh but magnumforce, the speed of an empty train *IS* less than the speed of a train filled with those on "the theme park giant". You are right that the effect of gravity is the same in both cases. However, it is the *friction* that will cause the disparity. Because of the wonderful law of inertia, the frictional force will slow down the lighter train to a greater extent than slowwing down a heavier train, hence, the heavier train *can* go faster than a light one.

Of course, in this example, I assumed the friction force to be constant. In real world, the friction will increase proportional to the weight (actually normal force) but not knowing the coefficients of rolling friction of urathane wheels and steel rails. But now I'm getting too techy, so I'll just stop.
jeremy

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"Nobody writes about the planes that land." Steve Salerno Washington Times 7-10-01

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Tuesday, January 8, 2002 2:22 PM
B&M put in all the trim brake from the start so if the train is RUNING faster that B&M DESIGNED it to run then theycan slow it down.
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Tuesday, January 8, 2002 2:31 PM
Hehehe, some of you are acting like this whole B&M trim brake thing is new.  Since '99 they've been designing their coasters with preset trims. Almost every single coaster since then has some sort of trim brake somewhere on the ride (noteable exceptions are Scorcher, and IOA's B&M's).

Most of their trims are not used (all floorless', Talon, Wildfire, etc), however, since the Mega Coaster has the highest possibility of speed difference, the trims are usually active because of that.  I hope that makes sense, I'm really sick and dizzy. :)

And Cameron, for some reason, the last trim on Bull was hitting every train for the last few months of 2001.  It was disappointing, but nothing I can do about it.

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"That's BS you MF! They're WT!" -- CP's R&D team

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Tuesday, January 8, 2002 2:37 PM
..........
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i play when i wanna play
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Tuesday, January 8, 2002 10:19 PM
I guess the thing I fail to grasp is if B&M *knew* that they'd need to trim it somewhere to slow the ride down then why didn't they just make the stupid lift shorter and save themselves the trouble? :-)

This is the argument that always comes to my mind for coasters that need trims for running too fast (most B&M designs as they use the block as a trim, most Arrows, even the Intamins) I understand the higher lift hill looks more impressive but I'd much rather have a ride with a lift hill that's 10-20 feet shorter with no trims and it seems like it'd save the companies and the parks money as well...
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Wednesday, January 9, 2002 6:20 AM
Colin: I think the point is that the trims aren't always necessary and even if the coaster is designed to not need the trims while the train is empty, the extra mass keeps the train going fast and the mass and therefore the ammount of speed that the train retains changes all the time so the trims are there to compensate for the variation in mass and speed of the train.  if used properly the trims don't really take away from the ride and the perserve the structure so it will be around longer and you can enjoy it more.
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Knott's Berry Farm Cuba ~South Park
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Wednesday, January 9, 2002 6:27 AM
i don't rememberm a brake being on the third drop in it's first season. i got real good airtime in the back seat.
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Wednesday, January 9, 2002 6:31 AM

Legendary said:
And Cameron, for some reason, the last trim on Bull was hitting every train for the last few months of 2001.  It was disappointing, but nothing I can do about it.

Oh .. well .. there you go .. I didn't get to the park at all for the last few months of the season! ;)

Cam.

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Cameron Silver

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