Please Help Bell's

Monday, November 13, 2006 9:43 PM
You can make a difference in keeping this park open. The decision to close this park rests with 5 individuals.......all who are looking for input from the public on what to do.

Please go to the news section to get more information. http://www.coasterbuzz.com/2006-313-412922.htm

Jeff, since the news in regard to this story seems to change daily, can we keep this thread open so we can let people know that something has been updated.

Help keep Bell's open!


Let the good times roll - Zingo
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Monday, November 13, 2006 9:58 PM
Mamoosh's avatar I am a fan of the park and the vastly under-rated Zingo and hope that something can be done to either keep the park open in its current location or give Randy Bell enough time to move everything rather than be victim to the wrecking ball. That being said I doubt opinions fron non-locals will carry much weight. I'm not trying to discourage anyone from trying to help or voicing their displeasure, of course...just being realistic.
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Monday, November 13, 2006 10:12 PM
I don't know about that Mamoosh.....in the paper quotes from a lady out of Denver were published and they talked about how this decision affected more than just Tulsa County. Also the article on the news tonight talked about how the coaster Websites and blogs are bringing national attention to the situation.
Let the good times roll - Zingo
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Monday, November 13, 2006 10:59 PM
Mamoosh's avatar Well let's hope so! ;)
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Tuesday, November 14, 2006 9:35 AM
Yeah, but if a significant portion of business (and therefore tax collars) come from non-locals (which I suspect to be the case to a certain degree), they might be willing to listen. Since this seems to be the only thing people can do right now, I suggest doing it if you want to see the park saved. And if you don't agree, then keep your mouths shut for once and let some of us engage in something we're passionate about ;)
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Tuesday, November 14, 2006 10:41 AM
rollergator's avatar Non-locals spend more on hotels and restaurants when we visit....tourist dollars are worth more than locals' dollars....

Don't they read the FL papers? ;)

I'll send in my two cents....for whatever it's worth....(about two cents I imagine).

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Tuesday, November 14, 2006 10:42 AM
But if 50 of us send our thoughts, that's a dollar!
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Wednesday, November 15, 2006 10:54 PM
Finally a story that mentions a conflict of interest between the Murphy's who compete with Bell's and their contributions to Commissioner Miller.

http://www.kotv.com/news/local/story/?id=114440


Let the good times roll - Zingo
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Wednesday, November 15, 2006 11:56 PM
Jeff's avatar When you have any kind of connection like that and you're in public office, you abstain from voting on those matters, especially in local government where everyone is related, sleeping together or knows each other.

Jeff - Webmaster/Editor - CoasterBuzz.com - My Blog - Twitter - Video

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Thursday, November 16, 2006 9:36 AM
Which is why local goverments are very often fatally flawed by nature.
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Thursday, November 16, 2006 10:34 AM
Jeff's avatar They don't have to be. That transparency should be expected. When I worked in a school district one of the board members worked at the local hospital. Any time something came up regarding the hospital, he abstained from voting (like when they'd contract for athletic physicals).

Jeff - Webmaster/Editor - CoasterBuzz.com - My Blog - Twitter - Video

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Thursday, November 16, 2006 1:27 PM
Bell's doesn't want to release the business plan and now there is a gag order placed on Tulsa County officials by their lawyer.

http://www.tulsaworld.com/newsStory.asp?ID=061116_Ne_A15_Lawye2131

I beginning to think since Tulsa County was starting to open mouth and insert foot, the best way to stop that was to officially seal mouth shut.


Let the good times roll - Zingo
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Thursday, November 16, 2006 1:30 PM
In theory, yes. But in practice there are a lot of occasions in local government where conflict of interest is allowed to occur. Most times it's subtle and indirect.

We see it a lot of times when we submit plans to various townships. You can't prove it because they don't come out and tell you "we're not going to approve your plan because you bought the property out from under my brother-in-law." But they will tell you they're rejecting the plan because they feel you haven't adequately addressed their concerns about traffic or stormwater or whatever.

In the Bell's case, just from reading the articles here, this commissioner Miller seemed to be the most outspoken about not renewing the lease. Will she say it's because they're competing with the husband one of her contributors? No, but she seemed willing to do it on the grounds their financial plan is inadequate-- a burden they haven't seemed to require of any other tenant.

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Thursday, November 16, 2006 4:56 PM
Jeff's avatar Trust me, smaller government units also don't want to get sued because they can't afford to defend themselves. I've seen in happen time and time again. That's why Wal-Mart basically gets to build where ever they want. It's one thing to have zoning on the books, it's another to deny development without reason.

Jeff - Webmaster/Editor - CoasterBuzz.com - My Blog - Twitter - Video

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Thursday, November 16, 2006 5:56 PM
Who said anything about Wal-mart? Sure the big corporations can throw their weight around and local governments give in. But I've seen local governments do the same against smaller businesses and individuals, few of whom could afford court proceedings against a local municipality.

I could tell you lots of stories about my own experiences dealing with clients and municipalities. There's also plenty of litigation across the state of PA as well between municipalities and landowners. (West Mifflin and Kennywood ring a bell?)

This isn't about that, but I feel some of the same principles apply. A smaller business (not Wal-Mart) is being ordered to open their books or lose their lease. Apparently no other tenant-- including the one that contributed to the Commissioner-- is being given the same order. Do you think the county is afraid of being sued by Bells? They probably think they can stonewall and wear them down until they're too broke to continue any legal action. Then they'll have to vacate, and the county gets what they wanted in the first place. And to top it off, they'll still insist they did nothing wrong or inequitable.

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Friday, November 17, 2006 9:11 AM
Actually, a lot of smaller municipalities are rallying against Wal-Mart building stores in this part of New Jersey, apparantly unhappy with many aspects of that stain on modern society. And it's not really limited to Wal-Marts, pretty much all big box stores are frowned upon in these parts nowadays.
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Friday, November 17, 2006 10:08 AM
rollergator's avatar Bottom line for me, with deregulation, the threat of lawsuits, and the new (improved?) rules re: eminent domain...there's been a revision to the Golden Rule:

"He who holds the gold, makes the rules"... ;)


If Big Box stores wanted to clean up their reputations, it really wouldn't be any more difficult than treating their employees like, well, like people...wouldn't hurt of they'd quit going into towns and making ALL kinds of demands about who should pay for what so they'll come in and "create jobs".

As IF....every company creates jobs....or is a one-man show....

*** Edited 11/17/2006 3:10:02 PM UTC by rollergator***

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Friday, November 17, 2006 10:28 AM
Jeff's avatar My point is that I'm not so damn cynical like you guys are. Small town government can work, and the inbreeding and big fish/small pond thing can and should be dealt with.

Jeff - Webmaster/Editor - CoasterBuzz.com - My Blog - Twitter - Video

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Friday, November 17, 2006 10:34 AM
I think their point is that sometimes it works and sometimes it doesn't. And the possibility that there is more to the Bell's situation then just their business plan shouldn't be outright dismissed.

I've also heard it said that county government is one of the most useless forms of government ever created. This story looks to support that argument.

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Friday, November 17, 2006 10:35 AM
rollergator's avatar

Jeff said:My point is that I'm not so damn cynical like you guys are.

That's alright Jeff, very few people are... ;)

LOL! :)

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