P Plunge Declared Safe

Sunday, September 30, 2001 5:08 AM
http://members.aol.com/rides911/accidents.htm
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G.Bush:We will find those who did it, smoke them out of their holes, get them running, and bring them to justice.
I pray that I will never see a Six Flags Conneaut Lake
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Sunday, September 30, 2001 6:49 AM
You know what I hate about that site? No attribution. Who knows who wrote that story. How long will it be before the copyright owners start getting on his or her case?

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Jeff - Webmaster/Admin - CoasterBuzz.com
"From the global village... in the age of communication!"
Watch the grass grow!

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Sunday, September 30, 2001 7:15 AM
Well you all ride it and tell me what it was like..I think I'll pass for now...
jeremy

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"When I take action I'm not going to fire a $2 million missile at a $10 empty tent and hit a camel in the butt. It's going to be decisive." GWB

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Sunday, September 30, 2001 10:06 AM
If this was the case then I am a bit confused. Even with the restraints pushed down you can still turn you head around and talk to people. From the all the articles I've seen before, It dose not make much sense. If this was the case and it was just an unfastend belt, then I wouls see no need to keep that ludicrous sign about  how "you have to fasten you own belt" in front of Millennium Force.

 

If Intamin is denying any involvement I think this would seriously dampen there relationship with Cedar Fair, if it hasn't been dampened enough already.

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Save Cheese on a stick!

*** This post was edited by Joe E. on 9/30/2001. ***

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Sunday, September 30, 2001 12:01 PM
Meanwhile, at least three passengers who were in the same boat as the victim say that ride operators did not check to make sure that the seat belts of riders on the left side of the boat had been fastened before the ride began.

The park claims all procedures WERE followed.  I certainly don't know which of these IS true, both both CAN NOT be true.  Also, Intamin claims you can't be restrained (read:lap bar restraint), AND turn around in your seat, which also seems to be, at the very least debatable.  Note:  park officials say that her seat belt and lap bar "were in their correct and locked position" when her boat returned to the dock. 

Somewhere in these statements lie the actual facts, and the ensuing lawsuits will hinge on those facts.  I'll go out on a limb, LOL, and predict an out-of-court settlement.

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Son of Drop Zone - PKI CoasterCamp I Champions!!!

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Sunday, September 30, 2001 7:33 PM
If they investigate this thing right, they are going to find out that there is only one way anybody could have come out of that boat, and it won't be a pleasant finding. :(

--Dave Althoff, Jr.
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Sunday, September 30, 2001 7:44 PM
I don't know what you are talking about, that Perilous Plunge has been declared safe.
It wasn't open today.
I will believe it when I read it from a reliable source.
Now I know the ride is safe, but it seems that they have only begun to investigate this case.
they haven't declared anything yet.

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Knotts Halloween Haunt!!
29 years and still screaming.

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Sunday, September 30, 2001 8:05 PM
What actually happened? Was she tossed out at the beginning of the drop? Where did she land?
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"Villain-Once You Drop, The Fun Don't Stop!"~SFWoA Rules In 2001~X Marks The Spot In 2001(SFWoA)~With SFWoA ANYTHING Is Possible!
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Sunday, September 30, 2001 8:07 PM

gatorwoodie said:
"Meanwhile, at least three passengers who were in the same boat as the victim say that ride operators did not check to make sure that the seat belts of riders on the left side of the boat had been fastened before the ride began.

The park claims all procedures WERE followed.  I certainly don't know which of these IS true, both both CAN NOT be true. "



Strangely enough, both could be true. Maybe it's NOT park policy to check the seat belt. I know several parks dont check seatbelts on some coasters (CP and Mean Streak comes to mind) though admittedly I've seen the belts checked on the two Intamin coasters I've ridden (SFA & CP) and they use similar restraints.

Oh and RideMan, what are you thinking? Email me if you dont want it public.
jeremy
--with piqued interest

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Sunday, September 30, 2001 8:19 PM
When did You ever see Seatbelts not checked at CP?
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Monday, October 1, 2001 2:48 AM

CoasterFanMatt said:
I don't know what you are talking about, that Perilous Plunge has been declared safe.
It wasn't open today.
I will believe it when I read it from a reliable source.
Now I know the ride is safe, but it seems that they have only begun to investigate this case.
they haven't declared anything yet.
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Knotts Halloween Haunt!!
29 years and still screaming.

That does not necessarily mean the ride is open now. That was just a statement from the manufacturer after the firm took their own inspection on their own product. How the hell in the world would that have to mean the ride is open? It will open after further investigations and until they can come up with a definite answer to this tragedy, the ride will still be standing idle. It was JUST a statement. Did that press release say anything about the ride running again? Please people, read things with perciseness. And I really get agitated by people who are always slow on the news. You're either in a cave or you're not.

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Monday, October 1, 2001 6:21 AM

BeastieBrent said:
"When did You ever see Seatbelts not checked at CP?"

Umm..every time I've ridden Mean Streak. Oh sure, they check the lapbars, but I dont remember them tugging on the seatbelt. Same goes for Magnum and Gemini. Now on Millie, they actually *do* pull on the belt, but that's the only one I recall.
jeremy

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"When I take action I'm not going to fire a $2 million missile at a $10 empty tent and hit a camel in the butt. It's going to be decisive." GWB

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Monday, October 1, 2001 7:35 AM
2Hostyl (Jeremy) is absolutely correct regarding many coaster ops at CP and other parks not checking seat belts. There are always going to be spots where belts are not checked due to amounts of riders and rides per hour needed to be accomplished. If you are STUPID enough to ride without a seatbelt, you deserve all the consequences it can bring. Perhaps, the next step is automatic belting of passengers in coaster trains? This could avoid some problems and issues for everyone.
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Monday, October 1, 2001 8:09 AM
Now, now, Coaster King of The World--I have been on more than one coaster with you where you were NOT belted in!  Sorry to bust ya ;p
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Monday, October 1, 2001 8:25 AM
How about a system which would not allow the train to move unless restraints and seltbelts are fastened. People can yell about capacity all day long; I would rather that than another death.
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What is hateful to you, do not to your fellowman. That is the entire law; all the rest is commentary. -The Talmud

*** This post was edited by DWeaver on 10/1/2001. ***

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Monday, October 1, 2001 8:45 AM

DWeaver said:
How about a system which would not allow the train to move unless restraints and seltbelts are fastened. -----------------

I believe the B&M inverted coasters have this safety measure with the OTSR's and the seatbelts that lock into them.
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Chitowns 6 year old daughter says "Daddy, Dippin Dots are nasty!!" I must say that I agree!!

*** This post was edited by Chitown on 10/1/2001. ***

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Monday, October 1, 2001 8:48 AM
I don't think the inverters can detect restraint positions, but apparently the hypers can (wasn't that Legendary's ride?). The only contact on the inverters is a long bar that pushes down on a lever to release the restraints. The hypers have this (actually I think the bar is in sections by car) as well as some kind of electrical bus to convey control logic.

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Jeff - Webmaster/Admin - CoasterBuzz.com
"From the global village... in the age of communication!"
Watch the grass grow!

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Monday, October 1, 2001 9:18 AM

Jeff said:
I don't think the inverters can detect restraint positions, but apparently the hypers can (wasn't that Legendary's ride?). The only contact on the inverters is a long bar that pushes down on a lever to release the restraints. The hypers have this (actually I think the bar is in sections by car) as well as some kind of electrical bus to convey control logic.

100% correct, Jeff.  The three B&M's in existence that I know of to have this are Raging Bull, Apollo's Chariot, and Nitro.  They're called "contacts" (SFGAd calls 'em stingers) and they're what makes the "clickclickclick" as you leave/enter the station. 
That's why I think the hyper trains are the safest yet.  There really isn't a place for error.  Every lap bar must be down a certain number of clicks (three) or that train "ain't goin' no wheres."

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Nitro, Legend, and IOA. Is there anything better?

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Monday, October 1, 2001 12:55 PM

coasterkingoftheworld said:
2Hostyl (Jeremy) is absolutely correct regarding many coaster ops at CP and other parks not checking seat belts. There are always going to be spots where belts are not checked due to amounts of riders and rides per hour needed to be accomplished. If you are STUPID enough to ride without a seatbelt, you deserve all the consequences it can bring. Perhaps, the next step is automatic belting of passengers in coaster trains? This could avoid some problems and issues for everyone.

Seatbelts are checked visually on these rides.  As ops check the bars by pulling up (and maybe pushing down if someone's being shady), they look to see that the seatbelt is buckled.  The lapbar is the primary means of restraint and thus it has to be checked to make sure it is locked properly.  The seatbelt is a backup - there mainly for insurance reasons.  If I remember correctly, Magnum (as well as many rides) did not even have seatbelts in the first year or so of its existence.  Even though they are a secondary restraint device, in the event that a belt is seen unbuckled on the way out of the station, the ops will stop the train (either in the station or the base of the lift) to correct it.  Also, saying that belts are not checked because of capacity concerns is rediculous no matter which park/ride you are talking about.  Safety comes first at any park, including CP!  It just happens to be that CP does a very good job with capacity as well.

 
Having said that, I think RideMan and I might be thinking along the same lines.  I haven't talked to him, so I could be wrong.  If what I am thinking is the case, then I think we'll end up seeing modifications to all of the Intamin hyper/giga trains.  I think we're still dealing with rider stupidity/improper riding, but it is something that will have to be dealt with.  It wouldn't have to be as drastic as an OTSR and shouldn't need to affect rider comfort too much either.


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-Matt
2001 Magnum Crew

*** This post was edited by MDOmnis on 10/1/2001. ***

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Monday, October 1, 2001 1:19 PM
I just took a ride on Millennium Force on Saturday night, and I have to say, if the lap bar is anywhere past my kneecap, there is no way that I would come out of that train. I did find that the Superman: Ride of Steel train at Darien Lake was a little different, at least back when I rode it the first time, in that when I sat down my knees were lower than my hips. If that is the situation on Plunge, then perhaps the floor needs to be raised, or the seat needs to be tipped back slightly. But in any case, I think what is going to come out of this is that the victim on Plunge almost had to be standing in order to be ejected from the boat. I have my doubts as to whether her size was a significant factor except to the degree that it means the lap bar was that much higher at the critical moment.

I worry about that because if she was standing, the profile doesn't seem to fit the classic thrill-seeking-idiot profile, in which case it seems to me that if she was standing, it may have more to do with whatever else she was doing in that boat.

--Dave Althoff, Jr.

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