New GM for SFGAdv

Friday, September 8, 2006 12:20 PM
Lord Gonchar's avatar Mark Kane, GM at SFNE is named new GM at SFGAdv.

Good move?

Story here.

EDIT: Never knew SFGAdv's Safari was the largest drive-thru safari outside of Africa. That's a fun fact. :)

.

*** Edited 9/8/2006 4:22:56 PM UTC by Lord Gonchar***


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Friday, September 8, 2006 12:22 PM
rollergator's avatar Hmmmm, interesting. Somehow, I just think of GAdv as being destructive to any GM that crosses its path...and SFNE wasn't exactly a model of efficiency on my two visits, so I doubt this is going to produce any noticeable positive changes...

Here's to hoping I'm wrong! :)

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Friday, September 8, 2006 12:36 PM
...meet the new Boss
Same as the old boss.

-The Who.

:)


Great Lakes Brewery Patron...

-Mark

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Friday, September 8, 2006 12:43 PM
Yeah, thats a great move putting one who ran one train at SFNE over at a even buisier park to do the same damn thing.

I know where Im not going.

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Friday, September 8, 2006 1:03 PM
It's kinda a shame they lost the GM that they started with this season--the one from SFGAm. We know that place is used to big crowds, and also known to be one of the better SF parks. Perhaps SFGAdv is worse off than we thought--even an experienced good GM "ran for the hills".

SFNE isn't in quite the same class of parks as SFGAdv--it's more of a medium-sized park than a large operation like SFGAdv. I hope the 1-train ops from SFNE don't carry over to SFGAdv! This is one place that definitely should be "up to snuff" on capacity!

Gonch, you didn't know about the safari having that record? They've been touting that for probably years now :)


coastin' since 1985

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Friday, September 8, 2006 1:22 PM
Lord Gonchar's avatar Yeah, well I'm not exactly a SFGAdv fan.

I've been there 4 times in my life and hated it two and a half of those times. Give me Dorney over Great Adventure any day.


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Friday, September 8, 2006 1:46 PM
Welcome to the Six Flags some of us like to bash :)

Actually, yes, give me Dorney over SFGAdv, as long as SFGAdv is performing the way that it has been for a while.

Plus, I can drive to Dorney toll-free, whereas getting to SFGAdv toll-free would be a real pain and waste of time.


coastin' since 1985

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Friday, September 8, 2006 1:59 PM
Lord Gonchar's avatar Well, it has nothing to do with costs associated.

That's part of what I don't think people get about my posting. Talking about park operations and the business approach of SF pricing are two totally different monsters in my book.

-Are the prices SF asks too much? No.

-Are they too much for the product? Debateable.

-Does the SF product generally suck? More often than not.

-Is it possible to go to SF on the cheap? Certainly.

-Is it possible to have a decent time at a SF park? Sure.

(this post would probably be more appropriate in the 'pricing' thread, but out of context would make little sense)


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Friday, September 8, 2006 2:06 PM

Lord Gonchar said:


-Are the prices SF asks too much? No.

$10 more than the average park their size= YES

-Are they too much for the product? Debateable.
Agreed, Maybe if they delivered.

-Does the SF product generally suck? More often than not.
I've had a couple good experiences. Mainly at a park they no longer own=Geauga

-Is it possible to go to SF on the cheap? Certainly.

With lots of tips, lots of planning and a lot of luck


-Is it possible to have a decent time at a SF park? Sure.

For 49.95 over the 59 dollar POP ticket. Yeah SURE!

(this post would probably be more appropriate in the 'pricing' thread, but out of context would make little sense)


I agree, wrong thead.
Chuck

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Friday, September 8, 2006 2:09 PM
Lord Gonchar's avatar Well that post was just sour apples. I was just explaining my take on SF. Not a fanboy, but see nothing wrong with their pricing.

And if you look at the other thread I detailed how it's possible to make 10 SF visits a year and score a q-bot on each visit with no additional planning or tips for a price of $19 per person per visit (for a family of 4).

Might be time to get over it, Chuck. You're not going to change the world. :)


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Friday, September 8, 2006 2:15 PM
Gonch, I wasn't much insinuating cost here. Heck, I don't have a Cedar Fair pass, but I do have a Six Flags pass. Realistically, I can get INTO SFGAdv for no additional cost, whereas Dorney would cost me an admission ticket.

Give me Dorney over SFGAdv because it's a better run park, shorter waits in general for rides, etc. The fact that I can get to Dorney tollroad free (this is what I meant when I said toll-free) is an added bonus.

Personally, I've only bothered with SFGAdv once so far this year. I can get in with my season pass, but I'm only going to bother one more time. Why? Because I don't want to experience their bad operations, nor do I want some of my friends to experience that as well. Add travel costs on top of that, and it just makes certain other places look even more attractive.

I cancelled one trip to their this year in favor of Hersheypark--'nuff said.


coastin' since 1985

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Friday, September 8, 2006 2:18 PM
Yes I will! Or the public will demand it. Eventually.

Chuck Kinda kiddin

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Friday, September 8, 2006 2:27 PM
eightdotthree's avatar Is this position change a reward or punishment? The customer experience at both parks is pretty sad.
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Friday, September 8, 2006 2:31 PM
Lord Gonchar's avatar I've only been to SFNE once (4 years ago), but it was one of the SF parks I kinda liked.
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Friday, September 8, 2006 2:42 PM
rollergator's avatar It's almost impossible to even imagine GAdv becoming a well-run park. Then again, IF (huge IF here, folks) it were run the way say, SFGAm is, the potential income would be *staggering*. Unfortunately, I'm not so sure that even CAN happen as long as the park is in SF hands. normally, I'm more optimistic, but it seems like the CULTURE at GAdv is too ingrained, and expectations are SO low that single-training on your "New for '06" coaster is not even considered abnormal.
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Friday, September 8, 2006 2:53 PM
Lord Gonchar's avatar You know I wonder if it even goes beyond culture.

I know that matters, but again I have to look at geographical location, but rather than money differences, look at cultural difference and attitude differences.

We're all pretty avid travelers and I've been blessed (cursed?) with living all over the place. Without question the east coast attitude (NYC, Philly, NJ) is 'cold' in nature. It tends to warm in proportion with how far into the breadbasket you move. I do believe Urban vs Rural plays into the equation a lot too.

Could it just be the hardened, minimum wage kids from the east coast attitude that's hard to change?

Is it a coincidence that the friendliest parks seem to be midewestern and/or rural parks?

It doesnt explain crippled operations (the debt does that), but it explains the difference between a kid who doesn't seem to care constanly gabbing on his cell vs the smiles you get at a HW or Knoebels.

Just another of the numerous variables that exist in my mind.


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Friday, September 8, 2006 3:00 PM
IMHO it starts at the top and not the other way around.

I can go to restaraunts across the states filled with minnimum wage workers and get a smile and what I asked for (At the very least what they offer the way it's presented)

I really don't blame the employees at SF for the problems. Sure I've seen some lackluster operations and understaffing but even at SFGADV on my visit, they were at least trying!

I once was told at SFKK (Not sure if it's true) That to ADD THE SECOND train required calling someone and paying him $200 for Chang. I've also been told SFGADVs union maintence decides what to run and when.

Any union I've seen, The companies operations policy overrules. special privledges as a company has a right to conduct buisness and write its own rulebook.

That comes from the top.
Chuck

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Friday, September 8, 2006 3:22 PM
Lord Gonchar's avatar Problems can come from the top down, but they just as easily come from the bottom up.

You can't make people care. You can't make people do their job.

As the husband who has to listen to the rants and stories of a wife in the hospitality industry, I can give you countless second hand accounts of hotel properties that are just 'unfixable' and employees bases that no matter how many times you turn over staff just can't seem to get the concept of common courtesy.

Because (like Gator likes to say...correctly, mind you) - this is the hospitality business.

Operations? Certainly, top down.

Crappy attitudes? I say bottom up. (in many cases)

The only reason I say this is that when dealing with anyone above the most basic levels at SF parks (managers, relations, etc) the attitude is usually quite good. In my experience the only people who really suck in general are the lowest level employees. (which also happen to be the most numerous and most visible)

*** Edited 9/8/2006 7:23:45 PM UTC by Lord Gonchar***


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Friday, September 8, 2006 3:23 PM
I think it could involve both: the attitude/mentality of a certain demographic, but also management.

I went to a local ice creame place last night, and you know what? Every time I go in there, the people are friendly, and the service is good. Why? Because it's run that way (and perhaps at least some of the people like their jobs).

We sometimes read about Six Flags employees who actually try to do the right things on the job, but their co-workers don't always follow suit.

I think that some of the problems involve these 2 factors (this is excluding maintenance and ride closures). A lot of the employees are told the right things to do, but they don't always do what they're told (employees' fault), but the problems don't always get corrected and addressed the best way (management's fault).

Park culture could have something to do with the attitudes and actions of employees, and if the whole culture is corrupt, then it's up to corporate to get involved and take the necessary steps to correct it. If it's just the regional culture that's the problem, then that needs to be dealt with by the local management (who in turn should be dealt with by upper management if they are a problem, and so on).


coastin' since 1985

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Friday, September 8, 2006 3:23 PM
I guess this is because he did such a wonderful job with SFNE?
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