More Phone-Based Virtual Queue Solutions
It's an extra 20 minutes for the people that stand in line without fastpass. You delete the fastpass, and it makes everyone wait less longer unless the line is actually longer.
You can just cheat the system though. Wait in line for the attraction, and than get a freebee the next time. I wait in line for Space Mountain, and than most likely when I'm done with that ride, I get to go on it for hardly any line with the fastpass.
So, it really still is 20 minutes to me. The fastpass slows down the people that have to wait in line. If I get a fastpass for Big Thunder Mountain Railroad, and I ride something else, you are still going to have a wait in a longer line like Splash Mountain, because of it.
The only way to get more time from the fastpass is to go on the stuff that doesn't have fastpass like TTA, Carousel of Progress, Buzz Lightyear (I think), It's A Small World, and so on while you are waiting for rides like Splash Mountain, Big Thunder, or Space Mountain that off fastpass. However, you are going to be running back and forth from ride to ride though.
On to something else, I had to plan what rides I felt I needed to get on Cedar Point. The reason I felt I needed to plan is because it was a pretty busy day I went. I think it was Saturday in August. I forgot the exact day.
I was thinking what rides to go on during the morning, middle of day, and even at night, and how many times to go on them. Rides like Maverick, Top Thrill Dragster, and Raptor were for the morning while Chaos, Matterhorn, Sky Hawk, Max Air, and the Racing Horses Carousel ride were for the middle of the day. At night, it was Chaos (again -lights!), Tilt-A-Whirl (The kids would be gone.), Top Thrill Dragster (again), Gemini, and Wicked Twister.
If you are in a rush, you are going to plan your day. I was only there two days, and it was just really packed for me. I got through it, and had a great wonderful time with my Chaos reriding, and reriding. The first night it was pretty empty, and the second day, it was pretty packed. The line was spilling out in the midway. *** Edited 11/29/2007 4:26:28 AM UTC by Spinout***
RatherGoodBear said:
The only problem is, the more you plan, the more can go wrong to screw up that plan. And nowadays, most people can't deal with a plan that doesn't go, well, exactly as planned.OK, I'm going to Park X next July 18...
(snip)
...Got all that?
Heh, right? :)
Here's the thing - how come when the idea of an itinerary for a day at the park comes us, we all immediately get the idea of precise times planning every detail and rushing to make the schedule? A high pressure situation.
How about something much, much looser?
9:00-9:15: First ride
9:25-9:40: Next ride
9:45-10:00: Nearby ride
10:30-10:50: See That One Show
11:00-11:20: Cool Dark Ride
11:30: Lunch
12:10-12:15: Big Coaster
12:20-1:00: Exploring
...and so on. You get the idea.
You allow windows of opportunity rather than precise scheduling for the most part. It would allow for time between rides, time getting on the rides, time to stop for food, drink or restrooms. If something happens to be down during you scheduled time - you either swap with another ride or better yet allow 'open' time in the schedule to get back to it.
I believe most (all?) virtual queue systems already use this 'window of opportunity' approach where it's not a specific time that you must ride, but rather a specific time frame.
You just gotta make a schedule that flows like someone wandering the park with no plan...and while I'm no expert, it seems like it'd be ridiculously simple to implement.
Rob Ascough said:
Guests at other parks? I don't think they want to plan things out, especially if you look at demographics. Despite the best intentions, Cedar Fair and Six Flags parks are havens for young kids and teenagers. Do you think most representing the younger demographic are going to walk into a park with much of a game plan? I'm willing to bet most younger people walk into parks unsure of whether they have enough money to finish the day in the park.
Perhaps, but I immediately think of something we talked about a while back in one of these threads - conditioning the guest.
Those teens in the 16-19 range have grown up going to parks that use virtual queue systems. For how many of those kids is it just an expected part of the experience.
Many of the parks using these systems have been for upwards of 5, 6, 7 or more seasons. If you're of the tween-to-teen age group...that's pretty much as long as you can remember coming to the park.
Plus, those kids are also the ones who've grown up with the internet and cell phones. I think the kids would be the ones most comfortable with the technological side of it. Especially something like the cell/messaging thing that CellQ is proposing.
Here's another neat idea (and I didn't see this mentioned anywhere as a feature - it's my own dream scenario)...instead of one single price to use the system all day how about offering per-ride or À la carte reservations?
Sure you could pay $40 to use the system for the day, but you could also dial in to the system for something like $4 or $5 per reservation.
Imagine signs in front of rides that read:
Text "reserve" to 55555 to reserve your ride on (ride name here) - a $4 charge applies.
A few seconds later you get a text back telling you what time to enter and ride.
I dunno, random ideas flowing there. :)
I think my original point is that it seems to me that the age group in question are the ones who not only grew up with the systems in place, but would also be the ones most comfortable using the technology behind it as well.
I can just imagine the day after visiting the park getting a text that says "Remember to stop by The Home Depot for all your home improvement needs."
I didn't mean it literally, smart ass.
halltd said:
That just means you didn't ride It's a Small World because it doesn't offer FastPass.
Jeff - Editor - CoasterBuzz.com - My Blog
halltd said:
I can just imagine the day after visiting the park getting a text that says "Remember to stop by The Home Depot for all your home improvement needs."
See? It's brilliant!
Man, I gotta quit giving this stuff away for free. ;)
You can be damn sure I jumped on it. Sadly, the message I in reply got towards the end of the show was "Sorry, you're not a winner, but be sure to visit our website to sign up for our mailing list!"
As long as the park is clear with the rates and consequences of using the service, I'd have NO problem with it existing (even if I didn't use it myself). I just don't want to see something like this turn into a "Jamster" debacle where someone texting for a free ringtone misses the teeny tiny fine print that says "By using this service you agree to a $10/month subscription fee..."
(EDIT: fixed a spelling error)
*** Edited 11/29/2007 1:52:35 PM UTC by GregLeg***
--Greg
"You seem healthy. So much for voodoo."
matt. said:
The only problem is once you plan your day there's about a million things that are going to eff up your system.I have no idea what sort of contingency plan you set up for ride breakdowns and weather and people getting sick etc.
RatherGoodBear said:
The only problem is, the more you plan, the more can go wrong to screw up that plan. And nowadays, most people can't deal with a plan that doesn't go, well, exactly as planned.
Yeah, there's definitely the unknowns to consider... not to mention personal preferences that you establish throughout the day. Suppose everyone tells you that you need to reserve a few rides on Kingda Krap because it's such a great ride... so you do, only to find that you hate the thing. Now you're locked into a bunch of rides on that thing when you'd rather reserve rides on something else, but can't because all the other rides are "filled up" for the day. It could also be a matter of one of your favorites just not running the way you like for the day. Maybe someone loves Nitro but Nitro is having an off day. It's basically you having to marry the girl when all you wanted is to go out on a date because there's such a high level of committment involved.
Jeff said:
You keep going on and on about why Disney "has to" run rides efficiently in order to support your argument that there's "no reason to have a virtual queue." That doesn't make any sense.
I'm not sure that's it. I think the point is that Cedar Fair rides often require a virtual queueing option while Disney rides often don't, despite the fact that Disney parks are far and away busier than Cedar Fair parks. It's not so much a slap in the face to CF as it is a commentary on the excellent operations at Disney. And while FastPass is a nice thing to have, I have never been to a Disney park where it is absolutely needed... and I've been to Disney parks a lot.
Lord Gonchar said:
Plus, those kids are also the ones who've grown up with the internet and cell phones. I think the kids would be the ones most comfortable with the technological side of it. Especially something like the cell/messaging thing that CellQ is proposing.
I don't doubt that one bit. I just question whether or not "kid" mentality will allow those guests to properly take advantage of such a system. I can see the plans being to ride TTD at 4:00 before everyone suddenly decides to want rides on Millennium Force at 3:55.
Imagine signs in front of rides that read:
Text "reserve" to 55555 to reserve your ride on (ride name here) - a $4 charge applies.
I can totally see that. ;)
*** Edited 11/29/2007 2:23:13 PM UTC by Rob Ascough***
I think the concerns about ads, etc. are valid. After all, they did originally say something to the effect they would follow the customers home after their visit.
I don't doubt for a minute that teens and tweens will latch onto the technical part of this in a millisecond. Many of that group are lacking in patience and time management skills. And while they're tooling around the keypad all day, most will be oblivious to the fact that they just incurred $132 in cell phone charges. A fact I'm sure cellQ or no park will have a problem with.
SF can put up all the signs it wants, as long as Baynum painting is doing the job. :)
RatherGoodBear said:
FYI, the cellQ site has been updated since Gonch started this thread.
They're on to us! Everybody duck! :)
I don't doubt for a minute that teens and tweens will latch onto the technical part of this in a millisecond. Many of that group are lacking in patience and time management skills.
I believe the children are our future. Teach them well and let them lead the way. Show them all the beauty they possess insiii-iiide. ;)
---
Some interesting things on the updated site. Notably:
"CellQ has the ability to adapt behaviour: encourage guests towards quieter attractions and restaurants; smooth waiting times for everyone."
It's all about the crowd management. My interpretation of that paragraph is along the lines of a group wanting to reserve a time for the super-mega-fun coaster and the system retrieving a two-hour wait for that ride then suggesting other similar attractions with shorter waits.
If it's something along those line, I love it even more. Screw FastPass. To hell with Q-bot. I want my CellQ!
...and for your guests, CellQ:
- Is fair - available to all guests, with waiting times comparable to the physical lines.
Damn straight. :)
"Half price platters at the Minetown Restaurant (which is empty right now)? Talk to me-- you might have something there.
"Why wait an hour to ride Maverick when you can get on Disaster Transport right now?" Meh.
"Hey-- check out Squids R Us-- nobody ever eats there!" Forget it.
Of course, as good as cellQ might be, it does you no good if you're one of the many people whose cell phone is in pieces beneath some roller coaster or lying on the floor of a coaster car.
RatherGoodBear said:
Many of that group are lacking in patience and time management skills.
But soon enough, they'll be the parents with the kids with cybernetic implants, reminiscing out the good 'ol days when you texted your reservation to the ride instead of having your mind read by the brain scanner at the front of the park.
Hobbes: "What's the point of attaching a number to everything you do?"
Calvin: "If your numbers go up, it means you're having more fun."
"Why wait an hour to ride Maverick when you can get on Disaster Transport right now?" Meh.
This is exactly what I have in mind. Except more along the lines of:
Your wait time for Maverick is 90 minutes.Save time with:
-Millennium Force: 45 minutes
-Top Thrill Dragster: 60 minutes
-Mantis: 45 minutes
-Magnum: 20 minutes
Something like that. It's nice because I don't have to physically roam the park for wait times. I can see right there what wait times are and make my ride choices accordingly.
Nothing's more frustrating than plodding around from ride to ride, seeing wait times beyond my threshhold and plodding to another wondering if I made the right choice.
Assuming what I have in mind is even close to this, it's pretty sweet to me.
Of course, as good as cellQ might be, it does you no good if you're one of the many people whose cell phone is in pieces beneath some roller coaster or lying on the floor of a coaster car.
Yeah, you guys keep saying this - but based on what? I always have my cell in my pocket. Never an issue, never even close. Why would a cell phone be any more susceptible to loss & damage than any other things people keep on themselves when riding? Are the parks really walking the rides at night picking up scattered pieces of phone all over the place like they used to collect change?
And why hasn't this been an issue with the Q-bot device that people are forced to carry? Or the room keys needed at Universal? Are people losing/breaking those left and right?
If you scroll down the main page at the Cell Q site, it says Flamingo Land used the system for much of 2007 and is bringing it back for '08 - anyone visit that park and see this in action?
Lord Gonchar said:
Something like that. It's nice because I don't have to physically roam the park for wait times. I can see right there what wait times are and make my ride choices accordingly.Nothing's more frustrating than plodding around from ride to ride, seeing wait times beyond my threshhold and plodding to another wondering if I made the right choice.
...or parks could install signs like Disney does that tells you what the wait times are for the most popular attractions.
I totally agree, though. As parks get bigger and bigger a central point (or points) with that info is covenient and appreciated.
Then again, retrieving it via a personal device is even more convenient. Wasn't there a park or company or someone proposing such a system a while back? (wait time, show times, etc to your phone?)
I dunno. I don't have a problem with the tech. Especially something as unobtrusive as a phone. As these devices morph together into one small "catch-all" device (think iPhone...for now) it seems silly not to use the options available if it makes things easier, more convenient or better in some way for you.
Something like this would qualify for me. :)
WOULD be nice if I could get in line while having a nice A-B product at the Festhaus though... ;)
Wonder if Gonch will buy me an iPhone for my ride reservations? :)
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