More people ejected from SFGAm for smoking.

Thursday, October 18, 2007 11:42 AM
Gemini's avatar Several studies (published in peer-reviewed journals) have shown that smoking bans have either no impact or a positive impact on business. I don't believe anything has ever been published in a peer-reviewed journal that disputes that, though studies using lower research standards have.

Walt Schmidt - Co-Publisher, PointBuzz

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Thursday, October 18, 2007 12:00 PM
^Good point Gemini!

Not only that, but check this out. If smoking ever went underground like the other drugs - it's not easy to hide. It's the stankyest of the stanky! It's pretty easy to hide other drugs including booze. You can smell cigarette smoke a mile away (well, I can). (yes I know pot stinks too, but it goes away faster)

So now, if that happened, we'd have dealers getting rich as they do already on drugs. It would just be individuals getting rich instead of big suited corporate types. Which is worse? I know what my answer is....

So... how bout that Viper and Demon! Can't wait, anyone going tomorrow?

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Thursday, October 18, 2007 12:08 PM
It's funny we're still debating all of this. California banned smoking in bars almost 10 years ago.
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Thursday, October 18, 2007 12:11 PM

Gemini said:

Charles Nungester said:If a buisness owner wants to allow smoking, A NON SMOKER SHOULDN'T be able to tell them what they can and can't do.
Using that argument, business should be able to get away with a lot of things. There are standards and restrictions that cover alcohol, food, equipment, health, safety, disabilities, and more. If a business owner doesn't want to build a ramp, why should a non-walker be able to tell them what they can or can't do?

They should be out catching theives and rapist.
Are you really playing the "should be catching 'real' criminals" card? Because enforcing a no-smoking law contributes to an increase in the violent crime rate? Maybe the police should ignore all crimes that aren't felonies.

There are hundreds of buisnesses in Ohio going out of Buisness right now due to this law.
Is that a guess, or is there real data to support that?Anyway, all that said, I'm actually going to go against the trend in this thread. I think Six Flags is being too heavy-handed with the zero tolerance policy. I don't think a smoking violation, unless they've been warned previously or are otherwise being disorderly, warrants removal from the park. It's too over-the-top.Six Flags has many other rules as well, including outside food and a dress code. Is everyone OK if they implement a zero-tolerance, immediate ejection policy for someone who pulls out a bottle of non-Six Flags water? If a guy takes off his shirt on a hot day, does security ask him to put it back on, or should they just drag him to the exit?

http://www.smokinglobby.com/smoking-ban-news/private-clubs-not-exempt-from-ohio-smoking-ban/

Dude, Try telling a 80 year old VFW member he can't smoke in a private club which the VFW is.

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Thursday, October 18, 2007 12:13 PM
Lord Gonchar's avatar

GoliathKills said:
It's funny we're still debating all of this. California banned smoking in bars almost 10 years ago.

Is that an argument for or against. ;)


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Thursday, October 18, 2007 12:28 PM
Gemini's avatar

Charles Nungester said:
Dude, Try telling a 80 year old VFW member he can't smoke in a private club which the VFW is.

OK. "Sir, you can't smoke in the VFW."

The ban goes beyond restaurants and bars. It covers offices, private businesses, etc. How does paying a membership fee or requiring patrons to meet some membership standard make it different?


Walt Schmidt - Co-Publisher, PointBuzz

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Thursday, October 18, 2007 1:10 PM
Gemini said:

Anyway, all that said, I'm actually going to go against the trend in this thread. I think Six Flags is being too heavy-handed with the zero tolerance policy. I don't think a smoking violation, unless they've been warned previously or are otherwise being disorderly, warrants removal from the park. It's too over-the-top.

---------------------------------------------------

You must not go to SF parks because you are warned all over the place with signs everywhere and they even have announcements saying you will be ejected for smoking. I am a smoker and I dont even bring them into the park. I also make sure I point out to security if I see someone smoking because if I dont do it, why should they. I for one applaud the effort that SFs is doing, it is the only way for them to make sure they get people to obey the rules.

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Thursday, October 18, 2007 1:21 PM
Lord Gonchar's avatar

Charles Nungester said:
Dude, Try telling a 80 year old VFW member he can't smoke in a private club which the VFW is.


Gemini said:
OK. "Sir, you can't smoke in the VFW."

Ok, that's funny. :)


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Thursday, October 18, 2007 1:50 PM
Gemini's avatar

Ajrides said:
because you are warned all over the place with signs everywhere

That doesn't make it any less heavy-handed. I think they should use a little prudence.


Walt Schmidt - Co-Publisher, PointBuzz

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Thursday, October 18, 2007 2:36 PM

rct247 said:
At one point, I smelt smoke, and I usually try to pinpoint it...

Is it some type of game I don't know about? Why would you try to pinpoint it?

-Tambo (who is totally confused now)

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Thursday, October 18, 2007 3:23 PM

Gemini said:

Ajrides said:
because you are warned all over the place with signs everywhere

That doesn't make it any less heavy-handed. I think they should use a little prudence.


I actually think they are being prudent about it by just ejecting people from the park. IF I were the GM of a SF park and you are caught smoking, Not only would i have you ejected from the park but you would also be given a $500 fine for breaking the law.

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Thursday, October 18, 2007 3:31 PM

Ajrides said:

I actually think they are being prudent about it by just ejecting people from the park. IF I were the GM of a SF park and you are caught smoking, Not only would i have you ejected from the park but you would also be given a $500 fine for breaking the law.


Damn Aj! Republican? Just kidding...

I think they should give people 2nd changes. I really would like to get the real story on this stuff showing up in the press... I mean, these smokers had to put up some sort of attitude or something...

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Thursday, October 18, 2007 4:05 PM
I agree Gonch it is mostly a for or against thing. I was just stating the reasons why It hasn't been put into effect here in PA. There are many of the chain places here that have already banned smoking altogether in the restaurant. That just means I have to walk outside if I want to smoke. No big deal.
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Thursday, October 18, 2007 5:10 PM

Lord Gonchar said:

Charles Nungester said:Dude, Try telling a 80 year old VFW member he can't smoke in a private club which the VFW is.

Gemini said:OK. "Sir, you can't smoke in the VFW."
Ok, that's funny.

Whats funny about it? The man fought for the freedoms you so rightly give away.

If a bowling alley wants to ban smoking or having non smoking on sat and sun. THATS THE BUISNESSES decision. It might be better for them. It might be the best choice for them.

I'll agree that bans don't affect MOST BUISNESS's but they do inpact bars, Cigar clubs and places smoking is prominent 1/3rd of these buisnesses are in danger of going under due to this law. Funny how 15 percent of the states revinue is made from those buisnesses.

Heck, NOHIO is so backward that their taxes on smokes are 70 percent higher than KY. It's extimated that almost 50 percent of the smokers get their tobbacco from out of state. I personally drive 20 miles, Buy two cartons and save 27 dollars

You say I can't smoke? I say you can't be buddist (Both are legal practices in this FREE country). Thats facism and there is no difference when these ban everything beliefs go too far. Oh, Lets not forget it's for the children. (THATS YOUR JOB)

Chuck, who agrees it should be any buisness owners decision to operate his property the way he sees fit. Not to have a law about it. There's aready 15 laws for every issue. *** Edited 10/18/2007 9:59:18 PM UTC by Charles Nungester***

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Thursday, October 18, 2007 5:37 PM
Not smoking in a place where it has an effect on other people is absolutely not the same as being buddist. I actually find that comparison a bit offensive.

Notice all the places smoking is banned is around OTHER people. It has nothing to do with the smoker.

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Thursday, October 18, 2007 5:39 PM

Charles Nungester said:

You say I can't smoke? I say you can't be buddist. Thats facism and there is no difference when these ban everything beliefs go too far.

Chuck, who agrees it should be any buisness owners decision to operate his property the way he sees fit. Not to have a law about it. There's aready 15 laws for every issue.


Smoke all you want! I think I'm going to invent a 'bubble' for smokers, so the rest of us don't have to smell that nasty stuff. I guess some people still don't understand that cig. smoke is very nasty to some people, and other (like me) get very severe headaches being around it.

Billy, who is starting work on a new patent ;)

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Thursday, October 18, 2007 6:12 PM

GoliathKills said:Not smoking in a place where it has an effect on other people is absolutely not the same as being buddist. I actually find that comparison a bit offensive.Notice all the places smoking is banned is around OTHER people. It has nothing to do with the smoker.

It's not ment to be offensive. Its a freedom. ANY RELIGION I support even Muslim. But if I walked into your buddist monistary and started yelling praise Jesus! Whats different than you (NON SMOKER) comming into my SMOKING AREA and saying I can't smoke. Just because you don't? I DID SAY SMOKING AREA not blow it in your face because I could also do that anywhere OUTSIDE A *ENCLOSED BUISNESS*

All Im saying is there was a huge amount of restaurants and buisnesses, Even some bars that went non smoking because *IT WAS IN THEIR BEST INTEREST* But now they are telling places WHERE IT IS IN THEIR BEST INTEREST to ALLOW IT that they can't. SORRY, UNTILL YOU BAN TOBBACCO, IM NOT BUYING IT.

Chuck

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Thursday, October 18, 2007 6:18 PM

J7G3 said:

Charles Nungester said:You say I can't smoke? I say you can't be buddist. Thats facism and there is no difference when these ban everything beliefs go too far.Chuck, who agrees it should be any buisness owners decision to operate his property the way he sees fit. Not to have a law about it. There's aready 15 laws for every issue.
Smoke all you want! I think I'm going to invent a 'bubble' for smokers, so the rest of us don't have to smell that nasty stuff. I guess some people still don't understand that cig. smoke is very nasty to some people, and other (like me) get very severe headaches being around it.Billy, who is starting work on a new patent

NO, I understand and I FOLLOW RULES, I got to the smoking area at parks. I step outside restaurants if I need one and I always sat in smoking section if that was available. I didn't go to NON SMOKING buisnesses (So why can't non smokers just not go to SMOKING places?)

I consider GUM, Chew, SPitting, Farting, Cussing all offensive. But I support your right to do so and if you go to the cussing section and cuss. I HAVE NO RIGHT TO SAY ANYTHING TO YOU.

Better yet. Lets just ban everything.

It's a slippery slope people. Keep it up.

Chuck, who will not make another post in this thread, You can PM me or email me but I know Im on Jeffs warn meter

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Thursday, October 18, 2007 7:15 PM
Jeff's avatar The thing is, if without legislation a business chooses to allow smoking, you can choose not to be a customer of that business. I don't know why that's so complicated. Let the market decide. Restaurants largely started non-smoking sections on their own accord, and that seemed to work out pretty well. Anti-smoking culture being what it is, I'm sure that trend would have only continued on its own.

It's still my opinion that allowing the market to figure it out would have been a better scenario. There are enough laws.


Jeff - Editor - CoasterBuzz.com - My Blog - Silly Nonsense

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Thursday, October 18, 2007 8:22 PM
AMEN :) and well put. Basically all I was trying to say.

Chuck

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