Man struck and killed by Raptor at Cedar Point after entering restricted area

Raven-Phile said:

C.R.E.A.M get the money. Dolla dolla bill, y'all.

Wu Tang Clan ain't nothin' to.....ummm, climb over - despite posted warnings....

OhioStater said:

Everyone is 100% clueless as to how it all happened, which is pretty difficult to deal with.

How is everyone 100% clueless as to how it happened? There is no mystery here, he elected to illegally enter a low zone by climbing over a tall fence and ignoring warning signs on that fence. The result of his actions is predictable, and that is why there is a fence with warning signs in the first place. This isn't rocket science people, if there is a fence, keep out. Parks are not giving you a suggestion with the fencing and signs, they are ordering you to keep out. It's very black and white, the reason he justified jumping the fence really isn't important, THERE IS NO REASON GOOD ENOUGH TO MAKE IT OK TO JUMP THE FENCE.

Yeah, I think there are a lot of strawman arguments being made that overlook the fundamental issue of a person going over a tall fence full of warning signs and entering what most reasonable humans would ascertain to be a dangerous and potentially deadly situation.

i treat these incidents the same way as a suicide. I see no difference between these idiots getting hit by coasters as someone who jumps in front of a train!

As someone who survived a suicide attempt, I don't appreciate being lumped together with "idiots," nor do I think that "idiots" is an appropriate way to refer to those whose poor choices have left their family and friends heartbroken.

Further, I do not agree that people who choose to enter a restricted area and because of inattention, distraction, what have you, are injured or lose their lives are the same as people, like myself, who, for whatever reasons they may have seek to end their lives by their own hand.

So someone who left their family heartbroken isn't an idiot for that reason, otherwise he may well be? There is actually no connection between the two, but a case can be made that if he wouldn't have made an idiotic choice, his family would not be heartbroken right now.

Pete said:

How is everyone 100% clueless as to how it happened? There is no mystery here, he elected to illegally enter a low zone by climbing over a tall fence and ignoring warning signs on that fence.

No one is saying he had a good reason, nor is anyone (his family included) even remotely defending his actions or placing blame on anyone but him. What everyone is 100% clueless about is why he made such a choice. No one I have spoken to who knew him personally has even the slightest bit of a clue, because it doesn't fit in with who he was in any shape or form. Got a friend who has a pattern of making terrible, life-threatening choices? OK. Got a friend who purposely takes risks that could end his/her life without thinking twice? OK. Well that was not him. This action was an anomaly that has everyone scratching their heads.

Because he was not an idiot.

He was not a moron, not an idiot, not a jack-ass, not a (fill-in-the-blank). He did something beyond idiotic. Everyone gets that. He was actually quite bright, had an advanced education, was very kind, and had a knack for working with kids and a passion to become a guidance counselor.

Wonderful human beings are capable of horrendously stupid choices, but all of us on here are lucky that one action does not define us. There is nothing wrong about criticizing his actions. You know who has done that more than anyone? His family and friends.

In general, I'm not really on board with calling the guy an idiot. He made an idiotic choice but we're taking the last 20 seconds of the guy's life to over shadow the first 40 whatever years and to go so far as to say he deserved to die? Heck, I hope when all is said and done about me, people look at the entirety of my life when they decide my legacy and judge my character. Not just a 20 second lapse of judgement (like when I tried to get extra air on a coaster by puffing out my stomach during the check - a possibly equally stupid decision to the one made here). I hope y'all don't think I deserve to die just because I made some dumb choices that endangered me.

Sometimes one stupid decision is enough to outweigh an entire lifetime of good ones.

The less you know about someone, the more likely it is you will define them by one moment. Some people are only known to large numbers of people for one moment (good or bad, brilliant or stupid, success or failure, etc.). It becomes their defining moment to the masses. Vast majority of us are never known to any large number of people. Is that fair? Not sure. But it is reality.

This guy will likely be known to the most people (who know of him anyways -- vast majority of people of the planet don't know anything about him and never will) for this one act. What else do we really know about him? For his friends and family, I suspect he will be known more by the totality of his life. At least eventually. This one fateful decision will always be puzzling/painful but over time, I would expect it will fade and whatever good he did will be more of the focus.

^^

Sometimes one stupid post is enough to outweigh an entire lifetime of good ones.

ApolloAndy said:

He made an idiotic choice but we're taking the last 20 seconds of the guy's life to over shadow the first 40

The only reason I judge him as an idiot for his last 20 seconds is because it only took the idiot 20 seconds of stupid decision making to end a 40 year long life. He wasn't drunk or high or anything, he was completely lucid when he made the idiotic choice to ignore the warning signs and the fence and the park rules to get a cell phone. If anyone ever makes a decision that results in their death within 20 seconds, they are an idiot. Regardless of how long they lived.

OhioStater said:

Sometimes one stupid post is enough to outweigh an entire lifetime of good ones.

Yes, but I live to post another day.

Touche!

And for the record, I don't believe you're stupid (although something tell me you already got that point), no matter how stupid I think it is someone would suggest a human would be defined by one stupid action. Your legacy of intelligent witty posts defines your legacy on the forums more than one less-than post.

See how that works?

And I don't even really know you...

I was gonna say what OhioStater did. Basically. We don't know him. And his idiotic decision is the legacy he leaves with everyone who didn't know him. Okay, he was a teacher. He should have known better than to not follow rules. Father too? Great example for his own kids.

In his last moments, he was an idiot. Regardless of what he did for 40 years. #sorrynotsorry #everyonealreadythinksimmeananyhow

But I suspect you missed the deeper subtler point, OhioStater.

Death trumps all. This one bad decision literally defined his lifespan. He lived to be just 45 because of this decision.It's a defining action. Pretty much any action that takes life - your own or other's - is defining for the person. It may not outweigh everything he did before, but it certainly outweighs what he was going to do in the future.

Sometimes a stupid decision outweighs a lifetime of good ones.

That's me being reasonable and polite and considering the man (since the conversation went there).

Me being real? I didn't know the guy. I don't know the guy. I can't honestly say I care about the guy. Nothing he ever did directly affected my life in any way...until now. As far as I'm concerned, he's the guy that went out of his way to put himself in harm's way. Realistically, it's no different than when any random person dies senselessly - I can't and don't worry about everyone. The fact that he made such a poor choice at an amusement park puts it on my radar and the fact that he made it at Cedar Point means it affected, in negative ways, people I know, am friendly with and appreciate for what they do.

However, I don't think the person is the story here - his actions are. That's why the headline uses one word to refer to him (man) and twelve to descibe the event (struck and killed by Raptor at Cedar Point after entering restricted area).

And the actions are bafflingly stupid on many levels.

Knowing your perspective about death puts your comment in greater context; I simply don't agree with the idea that death trumps all; in fact, I believe the exact opposite, especially in a case such as this. But, if you believe that how a person goes out defines that person's existence, well, I'm not sure how much grey there is between our viewpoints.

And you're right about the actions being the story. The media (the story) does not care who he was or how he lived his life because how he went out was so sensationally stupid. I mean, who gets hit by a roller coaster? But the story is totally different here in Louisville and nearby in East Canton. People who cared about him are (mostly) talking about how he lived, not how he died. And they all think he acted idiotically in those last moments.

What if you go out in some baffling stupid way? It could happen. Is that how you think you should be defined?

What if I make an idiotic choice that leads to my death (my wife may find this easier to believe)? Is that now my legacy? Did my death trump all, or is how I lived my life more important?

I think what GoBucks89 nails it, actually. If you did care (and I don't know why you would) about him or if he was your brother or son or father or whatever, you would be singing a completely different tune.

Or, maybe not?

Not so subtle point being, maybe we should leave the defining and labeling of a person up to those who knew him/her best.

#idontthinktekwardoismeaninfactilikehishat

I think what is significant to a number of people here is that the guy made his idiotic decision at an amusement park. If he was killed by a train at a railroad crossing, people on here wouldn't even care. And that is how it will be with people outside the enthusiast community. They will read about it, shake their heads at the stupidity and then forget about it in short order. Just like reading in the paper about someone who was killed wrapping his car around a pole, drowning in a pool or hitting a tree on the ski slopes. Just a stranger in the news making a stupid decision that has zero effect on most people's lives. I can't say I have a lot of sympathy about the situation, as the action required to get run down by a roller coaster is beyond stupid. And I certainly think some of the comments here are over the top and overly dramatic.

I'm getting back to this topic kind of late. Sorry.

djDaemon said:

You're not talking about a "no loose article" policy. You're talking about a "no articles policy" (so, you'd be allowed to wear clothes and that's it), which is of course not practical or enforceable.

And even if such a rule were practical and enforceable, it seems like an enormous overreaction to something that while tragic, doesn't really happen all that often, relatively speaking.

It is enforceable. II personally dealt with Morey's Piers policy for their Vekoma Hang and Bang coaster. The guy at the entrance actually had a wand and directs all riders to the free lockers. You can only get on the ride wearing clothes, and that's it. It's happening at Universal Orlando as well.

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About calling the deceased an idiot - All people are human beings and deserve respect, even if they got themselves killed. What he did was stupid, idiotic, moronic, etc., but I don't allow this one action to define him.