Kingda Ka Construction Update

Pkevin
He was referring to the gradual slowdown of the cable compared to the car brakes, not the actual braking system of the ride.

It makes sense i guess, the longer it has to slow down, the less intense pressure or force will be applied to actually slow it down, which seems logical for fray of the cable.

Side note-I haven't been posting in like a month or so, and I was wondering if there have been any posts about Ed Markey in response to this ride? I know he was pushing for height and g-force restrictions, so being that this won't be overly intense in terms of g's (overly intense being life-threatening) has he stopped his B*tching?

Yes, but it's not the cable that needs the room to slow down... it's the catch car. Unless the catch car will pass through the track into a brake run longer than that of Dragster, you're not introducing any advantage.

Dragster's arrangement gives the catch car a short brake run that generates a lot of heat (not to mention the friction). Magnets or not, that energy has to go somewhere. The heat caused quick erosion of the nylon in the catch car's channel (which is why it's sprayed with water now).

One potential advantage that I can think of by setting off the building another hundred feet like that is that the cables have wiggle room to absorb some of that forward energy that some people attribute the track wiggle to. All we can do is guess since we didn't build it and we don't have good pictures of the cabling arrangement.

Not sure if this has been mentioned, but one potential advantage of having the engine house back further is the angle at which the cable has to bend to reach ground level. I'm no TTD expert, but for Dragster doesn't the cable have to bend sharply to go down into the engine? If so then that isn't too good for anything. Lots of stress there. If the cable on Ka angles down at a considerably less angle, I would assume considerably less stress. I think the fraying of Dragster's cable came from that aspect combined with the heat. Not necessarily the speed alone.

No... not at all. It's an easy transition into the building, and the pulling cables are wound to the top of the drum (which has a far smaller radius than this "bend"):
http://www.pointbuzz.com/Gallery.aspx?i=1663
http://www.pointbuzz.com/Gallery.aspx?i=1662

Besides, it's rope cable, it's supposed to bend. From what I understand, the broken cables did so at the connection to the catch car.

Jeff, the catch car and cable are firmly attached, so wouldn't the slow down of the catch car and cable be the same?

Another thought that just hit me.. perhaps it's an experiment of Intamin, and they really don't know what effect (if any) it will have? Kind of like "well, we had these problems on TTD, so let's try this and see if it'll eliminate/lessen some problems?". I'm a fan of trial-and-error methods of learning, but not when it comes to rollercoasters :)

And yet another thought... Perhaps it has nothing to do with operation of the ride at all. Since the whole area is going to be heavily themed, perhaps it'll leave room for some type of ride-interactive-theming (Being launched through the head of a roaring tiger, for example.. or the trains could be the "tigers" and we're being launched through a [simulated] flaming hoop). I think that would add a ton of excitement, thrill, and originality to the ride. *** Edited 1/4/2005 7:44:48 AM UTC by dannerman***

Ah, I see Jeff. Just to clarify, when I said "bend" I didn't mean a 90 degree angle, lol. But I was thinking it was a bit sharper then shown in the pic. Not that a curve like that is too big a deal with the rope cable, as you said, but it does seem to add a variable with friction that could possibly add to more rollbacks.

I could be wrong, but I believe on Ka the section of track that had the guide for the cable was a much sharper curve. I'm guessing that the cable is going to continue to travel at the angle of the launch until the track curves up, away from it. This way you give it speed until the end. On Dragster I believe it curves away a little earlier and you start losing speed like crazy once you release. That's one of the biggest variables in rollbacks. Not to mention weather, weight and even the friction from the wobbling pullouts. All that can lead to those 118mph, almost get there, rollbacks. Everything with the cable/engine did it's job, but other factors cause it to rollback. As everyone knows it takes a ridiculous amount of time for the train to return to the loading dock. CP does a great job no doubt, but it can be from 10-30 minutes to get going again. So with the A-frame supports, minor changes to the way the cable is run, and probably modifications to the engine itself, they are attacking every variable to ensure a reliable product. *** Edited 1/4/2005 9:10:16 AM UTC by MrX*** *** Edited 1/4/2005 9:13:14 AM UTC by MrX***

Jeff,

Xcelerator uses the hole-in-the-support method you mentioned above. If you look close, you can see the hole in the support in the construction picture below.

http://www.rcdb.com/ig1574.htm?picture=2

-Sean

Ah... that's where I saw it, Sean. Good call!

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dannerman said:
Jeff, the catch car and cable are firmly attached, so wouldn't the slow down of the catch car and cable be the same?

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You're missing the point... it is "attached" and you can expect any such place as being ripe for failure. Heck, look at your bicycle's gear shift cables where they're clamped to the chain guides. Admittedly, that's more crude than what you'd find on these rides, but it is a connection point.

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MrX said:
Not sure if this has been mentioned, but one potential advantage of having the engine house back further is the angle at which the cable has to bend to reach ground level.

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To add more to what Jeff did. Bending of the cable really not an issue. As soon as that cable enters the hydraulic building (finally spelled hydraulic right :)) it goes around the wheel or whatever you call it. That's a very sudden bend. The return cable also goes through a sudden bend at the staging area, shown here. *** Edited 1/4/2005 9:20:04 PM UTC by gomez***

I didn't know if this has come up yet or not and I didn't feel like looking through the other three pages, but I have a question about the duel loading station. Is this going to have better capacity than Dragster? Or, was the decision to make a duel loading station related to something else?

Hard to say since it doesn't have a unload station. It may make it easier since there won't be as many trains parked so close to eachother.

Duel indicates they're fighting. Dual means there are two.

I suspect it's a space issue, but I don't see how it will do anything for capacity.

Anyone know where the signed piece of track ended up?

oddly enough... in my backyard.

*walks away whistling*

I imagine CP fanboys want to duel with SFGAdv fans...I imagine SFGAdv fans will want a dual unloading station...so Jeff, each spelling is correct! ;)

I believe the signed track pieces were for the storage/transfer track. I could be wrong, but they were blue, bi rail sections. I don't think they are used anywhere throughout the ride other than storage/transfer areas. The only other place might be the station. Which would make sense. That way you might actually have a chance to find your name if you are lucky. On the other hand, if you aren't lucky you could end up losing a foot. *** Edited 1/5/2005 8:05:25 AM UTC by MrX***

I believe that the bi-rail pieces of track are also at the very end of the ride, after the bunny hop, at the end of the breaks.

*edit*

Here: http://www.sixflags.com/parks/greatadventure/images/golden_kingdom/60.jpg *** Edited 1/5/2005 5:24:35 PM UTC by MForce2k***

Dragster is almost always running at it's top capacity, and it is not affected by the stations. There always seems to be a train ready to launch and does so right at the very first moment it can.

MForce2k...

The sections that were signed were blue bi rail.

If the video is correct after the camelback it will go to green tri rail and then to green bi rail at the transfer for the stations. The track in the station is also green in the video, as well as the transfer out of the stations. So I guess the only thing left is storage track.

And speaking about the capacity with the quad loading stations rather than a dual load/unload station..I think it will be fine and equivalent to Dragster with a good crew. They will most likely launch 2 at a time and you think about it like this - Station one loads up and sends 2 trains out. The ride is 50 seconds from the launch to a full stop in station. So with 2 trains you figure 3 minutes to exit the station, launch, and return. As soon as the 2nd train launches, trains 3 and 4 exit from station 2. Once train 2 returns trains 3 and 4 go through the same process. 3 minutes. By that time station one is ready to go and so on. There is absolutely no way to increase capacity because in that situation all trains theoretically should be able to launch as soon as the block ahead is clear. It all comes down to the 3ish minute dispatch times. If they hit those they are "Golden". ;) The only thing I don't like about the whole thing is that each station sits dormant for roughly 3 minutes. But like I said, there's no way to increase capacity so I guess what does it matter. At least train 1 can get a jump on loading while it waits for train 2. That should help hit those dispatch times.
You can say all you want about SF, but I guarantee they get a killer crew on Ka. *Maybe* it might make another ride suffer because of it, but I doubt it.

Edit - just thought about it and obviously TTD would have a little bit better capacity, because for both rides there should always be a train ready to launch as soon as the block ahead is clear. However, there is a difference in ride time so obviously TTD can send more trains through an hour. TTD - 1500 pph, Ka - 1400pph The keyword is *theoretical*.

*** Edited 1/6/2005 8:14:41 AM UTC by MrX*** *** Edited 1/6/2005 8:16:04 AM UTC by MrX***

Although the dual stations could be a pretty big problem if, for instance, just *ONE* breaks down during operation. Then what do you do with an entire station and partial queue full of people? That's a big headache.

I hate dual station setups. (i.e. X-Flight)