Is SFMM against airtime??

Sunday, May 27, 2001 7:33 PM
If SFMM decides to build an Intamin hyperwoodie will they be scared to run it right??? If Ghostrider has tons of airtime WHY can't SFMM have an airtime machine! They are known for for STOPPING their rides on the midcourse and REPROFILING Colossus even in the 1990s! Colossus had been reprofiled more than just after the 1978 accident! Viper, Revolution and Goliath all are heavily braked! Look at Raging Bull@SFGAm! They didn't KILL the airtime even though it has some trimming it is minimal! BUT SFMM is alway know for taming their coasters! I saw the Robb and Sarah's video showing SFMM STOPPING or nearly STOPPING their coasters in the midcourse brakes!! The SF parks I have been to have NOT braked their rides to that extreme nor does PKI so WHY can SFMM run their coasters at least as good as those corporate parks(which are still inferior to Holiday World or Knoebels)?? WHY??
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Sunday, May 27, 2001 7:41 PM
This comes up over and over and over and over and over and over and over again.

Parks do not trim rides to eliminate air time.

I don't know the real reasons but I can make a safe guess it has something to do with perceived structural issues and/or wear on the trains.

No park management has ever sat around a table and thought, "Hey, how can we make this ride really suck?"

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Jeff
Webmaster/Admin - CoasterBuzz.com
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Sunday, May 27, 2001 7:43 PM
SFMM against airtime? What about S:TE?

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Matt Lynch
Co-Webmaster, Kennywood Boulevard
http://kennywood.coasterbuzz.com
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Sunday, May 27, 2001 8:54 PM
'No park management has ever sat around a table and thought, "Hey, how can we make this ride really suck?"'

No but they may be scared to have airtime! But still why the inconsistancy of operation among even SF parks? Sure most of the SF parks uses trims but look at Georgia Cyclone is still a top 5 ride even with the trims on because they are NOT very noticeable UNLIKE SFMM whic are making thier rides! Maybe they are worried about Goliath's weak structure becuase of the wood or maybe it is suffering from the "Dinn Shuffle!"!HAHA!
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Sunday, May 27, 2001 10:02 PM
"REPROFILING Colossus even in the 1990s! Colossus had been reprofiled more than just after the 1978 accident!"

The reprofile in the 90's was to add a mid course so they could operate 3 trains per side. The re-profile back in the 70's was the big one. Getting rid of the negative 2 G camel back and the re-profiling evil double up folling it. I beive that all but 2 or 3 hills were changed.

"Viper, Revolution and Goliath all are heavily braked!"

The braking on thses rides do not give the coaster less airtime. The trims on Viper only keep you from going through the elements very fast. There is still a nice pop of air when you rise up out of the 3rd loop to the mid-course. On Revolution, the trims keep you from rounding the curves to fast. Revolution was not built to be an airtime coaster. Moving on to Golaith. The only part of goliath that has airtime is the cammelback. Since its before the mid-course, you still get airtime. Yeah, its not as much as it was before they slowed the lift down, but its still a good few seconds of float time.


Lynch- Dito. Someone forgetting about the 6.5 seconds of float time?
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Monday, May 28, 2001 1:23 AM

PINK FLOYD FANATIC said:
"The SF parks I have been to have NOT braked their rides to that extreme nor does PKI"


PKI doesn't brake hard? Hmmm... The Beast has more brake footage than any coaster on the planet, guaranteed. Down the entire length of the 2 big hills, plus the 350' brake shed in the middle of the ride (plus the brake run at the end...)

The most dissapointing thing about SFMM (in my opinion) is the Revolution. Or I should say, what they did to that beautiful ride. The last time I rode it, the brakes were on so hard before the loop, it nearly threw you forward. I think they did this to slow the loop, and give riders opportunity to look at that sign reminding you to keep ur head against the headrest (which the harness forces you to do anyway). Plus there were brakes on hard coming out of the tunnel before that awesome helix. They really should restore this ride, it's a classic.

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Ow! My lap bar IS down all the way.
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Monday, May 28, 2001 2:58 AM

PINK FLOYD FANATIC said:
"REPROFILING Colossus even in the 1990s! Colossus had been reprofiled more than just after the 1978 accident!



What accident?

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SFGAm: SCREAM. THRILL. REPEAT. Two New Coasters in 2001!

*** This post was edited by MFRULES on 5/28/2001. ***
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Monday, May 28, 2001 8:32 AM
I agree wholeheartedly about the braking of their coasters, but I don't think it's because they don't like airtime. It's more than likely caused by a) wear and tear like Jeff pointed out or b) people complaining the ride is too rough or something. That's probably why Goliath was braked so much, people complaining of the sustained g's in the last helix. It still packs a punch, but not nearly as much as it did last year. Oh well, SFMM still has great coasters imo. :)

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Medusa at Marine World: the best coaster in the west!
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Monday, May 28, 2001 9:00 AM
Goliath The second floater hill has mopre airtime than most woodies.

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the return of Intaminrocks
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Monday, May 28, 2001 9:03 AM
Goliath is NOT breaked THAT hevaliy anymore. In January yes, the midcourse almost stopped the train, but in March thay let up considerably on those breaks. Even then, there is no air to be found in the second half of the ride, breaks or no breaks.

It's not that SFMM is anti-air, The Goliath camelback is incredible! Most of their rides simply do not have airtime as the main feature. Actually, Colossus has some air, ride in car 2-1, there is some descent "frontal air" to be found.

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"X" marks the spot in 2001!
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Monday, May 28, 2001 11:16 AM

MFRULES said:
"

PINK FLOYD FANATIC said:
"REPROFILING Colossus even in the 1990s! Colossus had been reprofiled more than just after the 1978 accident!

What accident?







In 1978 a lady (I guess she was kinda big) flew out "like a rag doll" when the train went over the bunny hop after the second drop (she died). It was majorly reprofiled there. There's a whole lotta info on 70's accident's in RollerCoaster Fever book, like when someone flew outta the Texas Cyclone on the first drop... I dunno if that book is even in print anymore?
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Ow! My lap bar IS down all the way.
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Monday, May 28, 2001 1:49 PM
In a way, its good that Colossus was reprofiled. It used to be a coaster that you would only ride once per visit. The bunny hop that killed the woman produced a whopping negative 2 G's do to its 'pyramid' shaped crest. This left a nice grapefruit bruise on your legs. No wonder it used to be known as 'kill all of us'.

Getting back to the woman. Like coasterbill73 said, she was oiver weight. The lap bar would not lock down but she inisted that she ride. Well, you know the rest. FYI, there was a seatbelt, lapbar, and then the lapbar what chained down. Sound like a death trap? Sure does to me. Sound like fun? Sure does to me. :) *** This post was edited by sfmmman2001 on 5/28/2001. ***
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Monday, May 28, 2001 7:01 PM
In a way, its good that Colossus was reprofiled. It used to be a coaster that you would only ride once per visit. The bunny hop that killed the woman produced a whopping negative 2 G's do to its 'pyramid' shaped crest. This left a nice grapefruit bruise on your legs. No wonder it used to be known as 'kill all of us'.

I understand that is TOO extreme(-2gs) but I have heard that Colossus is now MUCH tamer than most woodie and is very weak judging from most reports! It needs to be -.5gs!! But it IS tamer than that I would think!!
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Monday, May 28, 2001 7:12 PM
How could SFMM be against airtime? Everyone seems to worship them...

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It's my opinion!
You ain't going to change it!
Why even try?
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Monday, May 28, 2001 11:41 PM
I have so much to say, but I'm too lazy to type it all. So I will say this... Magic Mountain could have one of the best collection of coasters. They have an addiction to un-needed OTSR's. Revolution, could be a contender for favorite steel minus OTSR's and brakes. (imo)
Colossus: what a shame. I serioulsy roll my eyes when i ride that pile of lumber.
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Ghostrider = good
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Tuesday, May 29, 2001 10:16 AM
Does anyone else notice how B&M trains "fly" through the break run? I guess B&M are the only ones to do this. Every other break run built by a different company allways slows down the train A LOT. Almost to a complete stop. But B&M doesn't. Does anyone know why?
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There is no such thing as a stupid question, just stupid people.
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Tuesday, May 29, 2001 10:31 AM

MF#1RB#2BVL said:
"Does anyone else notice how B&M trains "fly" through the break run?"


Words spoken by an enthusiast who has yet to ride Alpengeist or Montu, heheheh. Anyway, I see you've ridden Raptor and Mantis, they are pretty noticeable braked (at least to me) though not to the extent of Shockwave @ GAm (though they were only tapping last year). But the tapping depends more on the park than the coaster company, though I'll admitt, it seems like B&M are taking this into serious consideration (see Kraken!).
lata,
jeremy
--who only recently noticed that his SRM 2001 shirt glows in the dark...
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Tuesday, May 29, 2001 11:01 AM
Coaster designer John Wardley would disagree that it has anything to do with the parks:

"Supposing something goes wrong and a train has to stop temporarily in these block brakes somewhere halfway round the circuit. When the block ahead clears, it is necessary to open the block brakes, and the train must coast from a standing start safely around the rest of the circuit without stalling. Now, if the circuit is designed for a train to leave the block brakes from a standing start, it is therefore not designed for a train to leave the block brakes at full running speed, where it will belt round the rest of the circuit with an excess of kinetic energy. If the circuit is designed for the train to leave the block brakes at full running speed, the chances are that if it leaves them from a standing start it won't make the next hill, and will stall."
I would also testify that certain ride manuals at a certain park that I swear I've never seen say they apply pressure to certain B&M rides at the mid-course based upon the speed of the ride, which varies based on wind, weight of a loaded train, etc., and it is computerized. The secondary purpose is to keep the optimal interval right.

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Jeff
Webmaster/Admin - CoasterBuzz.com
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Tuesday, May 29, 2001 11:18 AM
Okay, I understand all that, but then tell me, why at one of your nearby parks (PKI) does Flight of Fear tear through the midcourse brake run with barely a pause, while Flight of Fear at my nearby park (PKD) practically stops on the midcourse brake run? Same ride, same train, same design parameters, different operating procedure. If that isnt proof of it being park based, they I dont know what is.
lata,
jeremy
--Let's see a John Dubya quote refute *that*...

BTW: Were those manual's "Owner's Manuals" written by B&M or "Operating Manuals" written by the park?
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Tuesday, May 29, 2001 12:06 PM
My understanding was that the brakes were wide open because of the number of trains running. Perhaps that's the case.

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Jeff
Webmaster/Admin - CoasterBuzz.com
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