Intimidator 305 Media Day

Whatever, it doesn't matter because grease won't help. The trims are magnetic. And they come one element too soon. They may be needed, but they could have put them after the crest. Now someone bring that grease over to Wild Thing and we'll dump it on those trims. Sorry if I interrupted one pointless discussion with another.

Now there's something that perhaps can be argued...

Let's assume for the moment that there is a very good reason for putting a set of trim brakes on Intimidator (I haven't been there so what do I know?). Are the trims in a reasonable location? Could they be positioned in a better or more logical or more reasonable fashion and still accomplish the same result? I'm thinking in terms of Magnum XL-200, where the trims were once at the top of the third hill, which was a horrible place for them, but have since been moved down to the bottom of the third drop, which is much less annoying (and allows the third hill to be a really nice float-fest). Could something like that have been done to make Intimidator flow better? Or is it already optimized?

After all, I don't see nearly as much complaining about the trim brake on Maverick, and that's right on top of the hill immediately following the launch!

--Dave Althoff, Jr.

Im not really seeing "logical" locations for trims.. Its either right after you drop on lift hill (horrible place), or when you hit the banked turn (which is where people gray out and too late by then).

The rest of the ride doesnt really need trims per se and there really isnt many straight aways to do it in, so I would say in this respect it kinda is optimized already. But thats my 2 cents on that.

I think they make sense. Think about what we have here... a 305-foot coaster with only a few peaks. There are only three hills (if you even count the last one) after the first drop. You've gotta bleed off some of that energy somewhere. As I said before, the ride is very nearly done at that point.

And I would argue that all of the bitching and moaning is counter to an effect being overlooked: Trimming on the up-side of the hill slows the train, forcing you up and out of your seat even more. Since when is that bad?

Trimming on the upside of a hill severly reduces the effects of ejector air, and I'd argue that it doesnt exactly help floater air either. I know that's an age old opinion debate, but as one who is in the ejector air side, upside trims can be a bitof a drag (pun fully intended).

Now, that is all theoretical as I've now been on I-305 (something I hope to rectify this month), but it seems that the first turn is the 'killer' part so could we be in for a first drop trim? (ala Hercules)

If your comment was in response to me Jeff, mine was in respect to adding more trims to it.. Not altering whats there. I think the ride is fine as is IMO.

No bitching here, but I do think that the ride would be slightly better had they put the trim after the final two hills. I'm thinking both hills would have S:RoS-type ejector air...then trim off the speed so that last twisty transition doesn't bang heads worse than it currently does.

That said, I the trim where it is now doesn't kill the ride, and the floater air was decent on those final hills.

i305 is awesome as it is and if it weren't for the neck chopping useless restraints it would be my number one.

That said, the trim brake would have been better on the upside of the hill subsequent to the one it currently trims to allow for full ejector air over the hump following the turn. Obviously a trim is necessary at some point because the final twisty transition and turn up into the brake run are taken at max possible speed right now, there simply isn't lateral support (or ability to withstand the headbanging) to take that ending with no trim. It was designed with the trim in mind.

On a separate note, I wouldn't be surprised to see a small trim appear on the first drop to bleed off a couple mph because the first turn is pretty intense beyond anything else currently operating. I LOVED this part, it's what makes the coaster the beast that it is, but I was hearing lots of discussion of "blacking out" or "greying out" in the queue, something I'm sure the park doesn't love. 5 out of my 6 rides I got lightheaded and lost vision until I hit the airtime on hill 2.

As far as trimming the first drop, I'd rather see the lift speed slowed down. Being thrown over that lift has to add some extra speed to the turn, right?

Surprisingly, it's not *that* much. We could do the whole physics lesson, but basically dropping a rock from 300' or throwing a rock down from 300' (even without friction) is not going to make a huge difference on final velocity.

LostKause said:
As far as trimming the first drop, I'd rather see the lift speed slowed down. Being thrown over that lift has to add some extra speed to the turn, right?

Wrong. The horizontal motion is negligible. It's pretty much all gravity.

If the coaster is going too fast and needs trimmed, then it's too tall for it's layout or poorly designed for it's height. ;)

I guess you have to think of it as two separate entities. The 305 lift is a sell, but it'd take a monster course to burn off all of that speed without "helping" it by trimming it along the way.

I never understood the hate for trims. I suspect much of the time the ride is designed with trimming the speed - at least in this case, as they are part of the original installation. You're not being robbed of anything by the trim, it's supposed to ride that way.

(I suppose you could argue against that logic in the case of trims added after the fact, but I suspect it's often not as "unintended" as it seems)

Would you rather see a 300 foot hill trimmed along the way or a shorter one untrimmed? The net result is most likely the same - after the trim, of course - so, I'd tend to prefer the height with the trim.

Im just shocked this thing opened on time, its the first US Intamin to do that in a loooong time.

Gonch, I get what you're saying, but I'd argue that while all Mack mice (to my knowledge) are designed with trims, Hershey's is arguably the better ride, by far, merely because it runs with the trims off.

Again, I'm not hating on trims; I305 is my favorite steel coaster, after all. I just mentioned that those last couple hills might be unreal without the trim. Then again, they might not.

What about the idea that a lot of complaining has happened over the years surrounding rides that are lackluster if you will. Now, there is this ride which is more then anyone has expected or maybe even experienced on a roller coaster, people cant seem to adjust yet, and there is a need to criticize, constructively! Just saying.

I'm not sure how many "clicks" the train is moving at going up the hill, but I'm sure slowing it down could change the ride or rider experience dramatically.

Vater - Mack mice don't have trims, they have block brakes...that many parks use as trims to lessen the lateral forces. But as-designed they are block brakes, not trims.

Jeff said:

LostKause said:
As far as trimming the first drop, I'd rather see the lift speed slowed down. Being thrown over that lift has to add some extra speed to the turn, right?

Wrong. The horizontal motion is negligible. It's pretty much all gravity.

I think I remember reading somewhere they were either thinking about or actually altered the lift speed of El Toro to change its speed.

Aside from that, the trims on RB's camel back just upset me and don't add any air. Trims may need to be on straight track, but they could do it after the beautiful hill they are on now. Since they already have braces there to hold something, they can add some LIMS so they get it thru their thick skulls that you go over airtime hills fast. Then they can put the brakes on top of the next hill and we can compare and contrast if speed or trims are better.

Moosh--yeah, but...um...that doesn't help my argument at all.

:)

LostKause said:
As far as trimming the first drop, I'd rather see the lift speed slowed down.

Oddly enough it does an eerie slow down/speed up towards the top.. Have yet to understand why that occurs but its consistent. Not that it has any net effect, just bugs me a small bit when I get towards the apex.

Hmmmm...

Maybe it has something to do with it waiting for the other train to clear the next block?