Interesting Poll Results so far

Monday, November 26, 2001 9:19 AM
Interesting numbers so far. When I voted, I expected to see that most thought that enthusiasts were really in touch with what the industry is about, but I was kind of surprised to see that only around 24% thought they were "in touch" or "for the most part in touch", while 33% thought "not really" (which is what I voted for) or "not at all".

Does this mean that 33% of us believe that we really are not much different than the GP, just a little more informed (I say that is the case) or that they themselves are well in touch, but not many others are?

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"I wasn't always this cynical, but then I started kindergarden..."

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Monday, November 26, 2001 9:24 AM
I think that means that the CoasterBuzz readers who are actually voting, believe that MOST enthusiasts are out of touch with the reality of amusement parks. Judging by the amount of whining Wicked Twister is prompting among enthusiasts, I sure know how *I* voted ;)


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--Greg
"Beat the rush, sign up for your post-Mean Streak MRI now..."
My page  My other page  And my coaster page

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Monday, November 26, 2001 9:32 AM
Is it me or does it seem that the more we (me especially) learn about coasters and parks...  the less I feel we (again.. me especially) actually know about the true goings on..

I wonder if the more "learned" buzzers actually voted closer to the "not at all" side rather than the "yes" side.

*Side Note*  Kinda like when I was 18 I thought I knew alot...  but at 27, I wonder if I know anything at all.  :)

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Homey G, proud founder of the CCC. Join up now! :oÞ

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Monday, November 26, 2001 9:42 AM
I voted "not all at" for one simple reason - you're comparing apples and oranges. Entusiasts by nature enjoy the rides. The amusement industry is just that...an industry or business. If we were all business enthusiasts discussing parks from that side of things then maybe we'd be considered a little "in touch".

As is being discussed so much lately, the parks don't cater to ride enthusiasts, they cater to to bank books. Whether we as enthusiasts like it or not these parks are businesses - bottm line. We represent a vast minority of the income these parks generate, they have no reason to build a ride to impress those who feel they know more about the rides or appreciate them more because of their enthusiasm.

The end result for the parks and amusement industry is to make the most money possible by means thought best.The end result for enthusiasts is to experience the most mind blowing, intense, cutting edge rides out there today.

Two totally different agendas, really.

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Monday, November 26, 2001 9:53 AM
To expand on Gonchar's comments, the fundamental problem is that many enthusiasts don't understand (or maybe just don't care) that the industry is a business. I posted the question just after the thread about Wicked Twister that Greg mention popped up.

Why does it matter? Well, when you read countless questions like "they should build" or "why don't they build" or "why doesn't Intamin build a," you find yourself being a broken record and repeating over and over again that, yes, these aren't charities for us.

Sometimes you get a situation where you've clearly explained something, like the concept of return on investment, and suddenly you see the term ROI thrown around like a new toy in instances it doesn't even apply. That's kind of discouraging as well, and I realize that it's generally the younger folks. The problem there is that you start to feel like the American education system is failing to teach people the basics of how our economy works.

I don't know... it's a problem, but not one that will cause the end of time. I just wish people would pay attention.

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Jeff - Webmaster/Admin - CoasterBuzz.com
"As far as I can tell it doesn't matter who you are. If you can believe, there's something worth fighting for..." - Garbage, "Parade"

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Monday, November 26, 2001 10:08 AM

Jeff said:
The problem there is that you start to feel like the American education system is failing to teach people the basics.

I fear this everyday.


Another side note to the topic is that many enthusiasts have a sense of superiority to them (in general, not everyone) and think they either deserve these rides or that the enthusiast community actually holds enough influence that their enthusiasm for the rides will transfer to the general public and in the end equal those coveted dollar signs.


Neither could be further from the truth. For many it is hard to remember the days before the internet and the advanced sense of community and knowledge that ride enthusiasts have today. I'm 28 and have been on the net since 1997. I've been into coasters since I was 13. I'd only really consider myself an "enthusiast" since maybe 1999. I can easily remember the many years I spent as a huge fan of these rides with very little knowledge of what was being built outside my general vicinity. The internet has made too many "experts" out of people. Everyone thinks they know more or know better than the next guy (even me sometimes as this rant proves)


What I see today is a bunch of newbies to the world of coaster enthusiasm (such as myself) who've only read about 95% of whats out there and experienced very little first hand yet still feel they know all they need to.


Anyone who's disappointed by any parks newest addition is missing the point of it all entirely.

 

.

*** This post was edited by Lord Gonchar on 11/26/2001. ***

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Monday, November 26, 2001 10:57 AM
Interesting observation about the Internet's influence on the situation. I'm the same way, I had been a fan since before I even had the guts to get on a ride. I noticed some technical similarities between rides like track structure and trains (when everything was made by Arrow), but I didn't know the things I know today.

There are different areas that you can "know" things as well. It's easy to learn who the manufacturers are and get a hisotrical feel for what they've done. It's quite another thing to understand what goes on in the industry community, which is really a lot smaller than you think. Everyone really knows everyone, especially between the American parks and manufacturers. But like any business dealings, you don't talk about that sort of thing publicly.

The most disturbing thing to me is that any idiot who can put up a Web site can post something and it's taken as the gospel by a portion of the audience. How many times do you see some crap like "confirmed!" only it's crap? How many of these "confirmed" things fester into fact? Not cool.

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Jeff - Webmaster/Admin - CoasterBuzz.com
"As far as I can tell it doesn't matter who you are. If you can believe, there's something worth fighting for..." - Garbage, "Parade"

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Monday, November 26, 2001 11:34 AM
I voted 'sometimes' because there are some enthusiasts here who do understand that the bottom line is money.  However most of the posts that I read are by people that don't understand this.  I think that this is because the people who understand don't tend to make as much 'noise' as those who complain for more improvements.  I'd bet it's about half and half.  And just becuase some enthusiasts understand a little doesn't mean that they understand everything.  There are many sides to parks: guest relations, personel, R & D, financial planning, marketing, and maintenence, just to name a few.  It is impossible for any one person to understand everything there is to know about running an amusement park.  Therefore we, as enthusiasts, should try to pick up as many bits and pieces as we can, and Coasterbuzz is a great way to do that.
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Ohio - Coaster capital of the world
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Monday, November 26, 2001 11:40 AM
I think most people don't realize the industry is about one thing, and one thing ONLY

 

money.

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Monday, November 26, 2001 12:31 PM
I voted for "sometimes" because there are some coaster enthusiasts that just don't seem to understand things from a business standpoint. All they think about is, "why doesn't my favorite park build a new roller coaster every year?" or "this park is always trashed, but it would be better to build a big roller coaster rather than fix it up." Some people think that the industry is like a big video game where you have unlimited money, and you can constantly build big huge rides. The amusement industry isn't just about rides, however some people still won't think differently.

On the other hand, there are also a lot of coaster enthusiasts who understand that the amusement industry is a business and when a park does something, they have a reason for doing it. They understand that the amusement industry is about more than rides and that parks can't and aren't going to build record breaking rides every-single year.

It really bugs me when "so-called" coaster enthusiasts whine and complain about how a certain park is building a ride that isn't big enough or fast enough for them. Parks have reasons for choosing the rides that they build. Some enthusiasts need to accept what is happening in the industry, and not go whine and moan about it.

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There is no force like Millennium Force

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Monday, November 26, 2001 12:58 PM
Whenever I personally talk about the subject of Amusement Park business, I seriously try my hardest to not let personal feelings get in the way and I don't believe I have in a long time, but when you can compare apples to apples and there'e one just a little riper for that same exact price, I'm really angry that they decided not to pick that apple.

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Danny

PKI 2002- "The Rollercoast is Toast!"

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Monday, November 26, 2001 2:32 PM
Like I've said, enthusiasts may have more knowledge, experience, passion and interest for coasters, but everybody goes to the park for basically the same reason, the thrill of the ride. 
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Monday, November 26, 2001 3:26 PM
To continue the conversation about the internet's impact, one must observe that all of us here have the ability to be truly informed enthusiasts if we merely dig through the information that is available through this medium. Granted, it's about 80% trash, but the other 20% is what makes it work - at least for me. I've been a big fan of CP and SFGAm for some 30 years now, but didn't really become an enthusiast until the internet opened the door to the rest of the coaster world.

So the point I'm making here is that while the internet has spawned a lot of dumb enthusiasts, it has also made a lot of us more informed of the way it really is.

I voted "for the most part". Probably a bit optimistic, but hey...you've got to have some faith in mankind!

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Without the chaindog, you'd never get up the lifthill...

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Monday, November 26, 2001 3:32 PM

Chaindog said:
"So the point I'm making here is that while the internet has spawned a lot of dumb enthusiasts, it has also made a lot of us more informed of the way it really is.

I voted "for the most part". Probably a bit optimistic, but hey...you've got to have some faith in mankind!"



What I dont understand is why "informed" has become associated with "enthusiast". Just because someone doesnt know EVERYTHING about coasters does not necessarily discredit their enthusiasim. Nor does knowing a lot automatically qualify you for "enthusiast" status. Of course I dont consider myself an "enthusiast" anyway.
ciao,
moi
--BTW: I belive in the 'total depravity of man'.
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Monday, November 26, 2001 3:43 PM
I voted not at all...cuz ummm...yeah....its pretty obvious
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Monday, November 26, 2001 3:55 PM

2Hostyl said:
What I dont understand is why "informed" has become associated with "enthusiast".

It was the poll that made that reference. There's something to be said about raw enthusiasim (for lack of a better term), though. It would be much easier and cheaper if I didn't know there was  two world - class rides in southern Indiana, or they are working on X  in California. And "enthusiast" is just a word that now seems to mean a person who likes coasters. I personally like the term "coaster geek".
I'm open for a better term, though. Any ideas?

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Without the chaindog, you'd never get up the lifthill...

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Monday, November 26, 2001 5:10 PM

Chaindog said:
"Granted, it's about 80% trash, but the other 20% is what makes it work - at least for me."
Thank God I'm not the only one who feels that way! I get so much crap from people who get pissed because I don't list their sites here or post every little "news" item out there. Like I said, just because it's on the Net doesn't make it gold.

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Jeff - Webmaster/Admin - CoasterBuzz.com
"As far as I can tell it doesn't matter who you are. If you can believe, there's something worth fighting for..." - Garbage, "Parade"

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Monday, November 26, 2001 7:41 PM

Jeff said:
The most disturbing thing to me is that any idiot who can put up a Web site can post something and it's taken as the gospel by a portion of the audience.

See, this ALMOST makes me yearn for 1988, MY first exposure the great Internet. Email, Netnews, and FTP was as good as it got, and we LIKED it that way.

But you know, what, in many ways it was no better back then (which is why I said I ALMOST yearn for those days). Netnews has certainly gotten more verbage as more people have gotten on, but the signal-to-noise ratio is about the same. And I'd happily bet that roughly the same ratio carries over to the Web. Used to be knowledge of how to use rn (or some variant) was enough to make you a self-proclaimed expert. In some ways, it's become easier, but the same thing still holds.


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--Greg
"Beat the rush, sign up for your post-Mean Streak MRI now..."
My page  My other page  And my coaster page

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Monday, November 26, 2001 9:05 PM
Im happy I go to a private school...lol

I think it is for the most part people who do not pay attention, but that is off the topic.
I think if the enthusiasts think before they write a post, then they know what they are talking about.

Just think a little and see what the consequences + pluses to a business deal (wicked twister (ex)) The public will love it, and it will bring in visitors.

So, I have full confidence that MOST of these enthusiasts know what they are talking about if they stepped back and thought about the situation for a min or two. Just my opinion.

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Six Flags Magic Mountain is the place to be for top notch thrills in 2002! X is the ultimate thrill machine!

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Monday, November 26, 2001 9:08 PM
Good point Jeff, but I was only three years old then, I was not tall enough for the coasters, :'(
Think about the children man!
There is so much crap out there, this is one of the only sites I trust, and mostly only the news.
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Six Flags Magic Mountain is the place to be for top notch thrills in 2002! X is the ultimate thrill machine!
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