Intamin Rocket Coasters

Call me crazy, but after seeing all the "fun" stuff that keeps happening to alot of Intamins newer rides, why do companies keep buying them?

I spoke with an insurance company that covers some parks, and they told me they will not provide insurance for anything built by intamin.

Now I know there safety record is not that bad, and all new rides have alot of kinks to be worked out of them, but do you think the only reason companies are still purchasing rides from them is because they had a deal signed already and production was under way at the time? Or do you think that these companies are just willing to give Intamin another chance?

I honestly, after watching them have to fix Wicked Twister at CP, Xcelerator at KBF, TTD at CP (not to mention the cable already snapping several times on that ride), and having to fix there restraint systems on nearly all of there rides, would definently not purchase anything from them.

Now could it possibly be that most companies (manufacturers) have had this happen to them in there life time, or is it just a possobility that Intamin has had a bad batch of bad "apples" (engineers) lately?

Thoughts, Comments, Opinions?

Jeff, if you don't like this topic, please feel free to get rid of it.
*** Edited 8/18/2004 5:00:39 PM UTC by TheNewLMHDesign***

I believe those in production may have been signed before TTD was complete. New coasters of this design may not be made until Intamin can prove safety and reliability.

They push the envelope and now they are paying the price.

What I don't understand though, is who does their structural analysis? With all the software out there now, I don't think a multi-million ride should have to go through so much re-work after installation. In our business people get fired/blacklisted for that.

The restraints issue is another can of worms.

SUV sales are on the rise, instead of decline, even though the rollover rate is so high and fatalities/injuries have increased to the drivers and their passengers (according to an article in my paper the other day).

What does have to do with Intamin? People will look past safety records, or the death of a few customers to put in the next big exciting thing. As you well know, most people don't care or know who makes the ride, they just want to get on whatever the most thrilling ride is at the moment.

Antuan, there are plenty of examples of multi-million dollar rides that needed a lot of "loving care" after installation. The list includes X, Deja Vu, Hypersonic XLC, Batwing/X-Flight, both Mr. Freezes, Batman & Robin the Chiller for starters. Unfortunately, it goes with the territory nowadays. *** Edited 8/18/2004 5:11:36 PM UTC by Intamin Fan*** *** Edited 8/18/2004 5:23:42 PM UTC by Intamin Fan***

Oh hey, it's another "why do parks buy Intamin if TTD has so many problems?" thread.

I don't think anyone knows the answer to that question, but I'm glad there will be a few more rockets for me to ride :)

-Josh

edit: eye kan spele *** Edited 8/18/2004 5:11:00 PM UTC by Raven-Phile***

TTD may have had (and is still having) a lot of problems... but again, that's a 400 120mph prototype that's asking a lot from a coaster.

As they work out the bugs on that, something to a much smaller scale to the likes of Storm Runner & X-Celerator, they're likely to get the coasters running a lot more consistantly. Overall, Intamin's safety record is still very good. A lot of their safety problems were due to rider/ride-op errors on their other coasters. Their main problems seem to be the cable to rocket the coaster. If it snaps, it snaps... so as long as they know it will wear & they have replacements to minimize down-times, that should be expected.

Although... it should be replaced BEFORE it snaps as to avoid the results of the shards of metal from the frayed one that embedded into the riders that last time (maybe bi-weekly or monthly?). Intamin should then either develop a stronger cable, or supply the parks with enough so they (the parks) don't have to incurr any additional expenses.

The rocket coaster concept shows a lot of potential... but Intamin's record of bad PR this year & last year with their problems has hurt them a little. Let's just hope that this new one at Great Adventure & Storm Runner will prove that on a smaller scale, these things can run just fine.

I dont get why insurance companies wont insure Intamin rides. I understand that Intamin does have a little bad record but still. I mean look at all there rides they have built Wicked Twister at first had stuff wrong with it and now its running strong with hardly any problems. Also look at Millenium Force at first it had problems for the first year and now its fine expect for the seat problem but who cares. And TTD it may have had problems last year and this year but look at the good side its ran a lot better this year than last. And im positive that next year TTD will run as good as MF.

All these new rocket coasters should be more reliable than TTD because TTD was a first and was kinda built without to much testing. So this rocket coaster thats being built at Six Flags should be reliable just as long as its not over 100mph and 400ft.

It does seem ridiculous that these rides can't, atleast structurally, be designed nearly perfectly before they're built; I've always thought that was the whole idea behind engineering.

I think that Intamin tries to get the most strength from the least amount of steel. That is why they went to the skeletal style track that they use. I can foresee structural problems with TTD and more in WT in the future. The launch track on TTD shakes violently when the train is launched and then both curved sections of track sway back and forth long after the train has went by. I don’t think that the launch track footings are set that deep into the Lake Eire sand and may loosen up with time. The swaying motion of the curved sections of track will eventually weaken the supports and break welds.

WT's whole support structure racks from side to side, not only the track. This will weaken the structure over time and may even weaken the footer.

Intamin is in for more problems in the future. Look at how much Intamin track moves when a coaster train passes over and then look at how much B&M track moves. Intamin tries to strech the laws of Physics I think.

Are you implying that with lots of time and stupid engineers/inspectors/caretakers of it, Dragster could fall over? Wow. That'd be a sight.

I'll bring up the very repeated line.

Parks were trying to push the envelope before TTD was even built, so then as they found out the problems that it has they're sitting there in their comfy poofy chairs going 'Hally crap, what have we gotten ourselves into?'

-Adam. Stretchin' the truth.

You have a great pov CP ismyhome all of Intamins ride do sway quite a bit. But I had always thought that they were supposed to to withstand the force of the ride, I have been told that it is supposed to sway and wobble or if not that it would break something if it wasnt. But maybe im wrong or maybe CP doesnt quite build the supports into the land but maybe they do that for temporary use because eventually some ride will have to go if new ones come in they dont have much more space, If you know what I mean.

Wow, maybe I am wrong look here at what I read in a Superman post. There are shadowy rumors about the structure itself being suspect and not certified by the State.

I'm not saying that it is going to fall over, but more problems will be found, just like already have been found on WT and Xcelerator. I think that we will see some sort of cross bracing on the curved sections of TTDs track in the future. Take a close look at it next time you are at the park and see how much they sway.

I know WT sways quite abit in the wind.

Intamin Rockets do what they do best. Boost attendence of every park they open in. TTD has finally reached a point where it runs well most of the day. Their capacity can be good and are very popular with the general public, and parks love that.

BTW, Wicked Twister was running very well for a while but latly it hasn't been looking good for this giant on the beach.

Having just been to Cedar Point, I can agree that TTD's curved sections do sway quite a bit. My guess is that eventually there will be cross bracings to minimize that sway.

However, TTD was open all day except for a 30 min thunderstorm. It ran so pretty is was unbelievable. Launches every 45 seconds to a minute with very fast load times. A thing of beauty is was. This ride will be fine for years to come

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CP ismyhome said:
I think that we will see some sort of cross bracing on the curved sections of TTDs track in the future.

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http://coasterbuzz.com/rollercoasterphoto.htm?i=2591

We're already seeing cross-bracing on later Intamin Rocket models.

But, isn't it obvious that Intamin is slowly but surely perfecting this ride? I mean, look at the differences between Top Thrill Dragster and Storm Runner. Yeah, Dragster still has it's problems but it's getting better. Storm Runner seems to be running efficiently day in and day out without any hiccups. Perhaps Great Adventure's rocket will prove to be even more reliable. Who knows...

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TopThrillDragster420 said:
I dont get why insurance companies wont insure Intamin rides. I understand that Intamin does have a little bad record but still.

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Much like the BIG fallout after the HW incident, it isn't always JUST what happens but what you have to SAY when something bad happens. The enthusiast community became its own worst enemy after the HW tragedy, and Intamin became its own worst enemy following the SFNE tragedy.

WHEN you make a mistake (and you WILL, we all do), own up to it, LEARN from it, and don't make the same mistake again. Do the right thing, SAY the right thing, and continuously improve yourself AND your product. The statement that came from HIGH up in Intamin after the SFNE incident probably has as much to do with *uninsurability* as the incidents themselves. It will take YEARS to undo the damage done.

Frankly, I still am more *concerned* about the Hydro incident, since we don't have the full story on that one, and that is the ONE tragedy on an Intamin ride that did NOT involve a rider of unusual proportions....time will tell.
*** Edited 8/20/2004 4:19:59 PM UTC by rollergator***

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CP ismyhome said:
I think that Intamin tries to get the most strength from the least amount of steel. That is why they went to the skeletal style track that they use. I can foresee structural problems with TTD and more in WT in the future. The launch track on TTD shakes violently when the train is launched and then both curved sections of track sway back and forth long after the train has went by. I don’t think that the launch track footings are set that deep into the Lake Eire sand and may loosen up with time. The swaying motion of the curved sections of track will eventually weaken the supports and break welds.

WT's whole support structure racks from side to side, not only the track. This will weaken the structure over time and may even weaken the footer.

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Are you saying that TTD and WT are sinking? ;)