Hersheypark Skyrush - Sunday, May 27th, 2012

Yeah, I can't say enough times that OTSRs would be a mistake on Skyrush.

Travis, there is definitely something about Intamin coasters and other rides from Intamin that often is unsettling to me. While I love me some Intamin coasters (El Toro, Maverick, Millennium Force especially), there are just as many fails from them, not to mention their spotty reliability and safety records give me at least some minor concerns almost every time I ride something of theirs. However, when they succeed, they SUCCEED. I liken them to the BMWs of the coaster engineering community: zippy, fun, but unreliable. B&Ms on the other hand are more like Lexus (Lexuses? Lexii?): Smooth ride, lasts forever, although not as thrilling to ride.

And all in all, could any coaster designer predict that this ride was gonna be THAT forceful? It looked like NOTHING when I saw POVs, and sometimes those supposed airtime hills that designers use really aren't that amazing in real life. Maybe they didn't even realize how a compact course like this would make for nearly unsafe ejector air. Or maybe they did and hence evil restraints. Definitely not saying it is right because if you're supposed to be one of the top ride designers in the world, you shouldn't have all the redesigns and adjustments and train modifications that Intamin does, but just thinking that maybe they've designed very similar things in the past and didn't have this issue because the ride sucked for airtime...

I'm not wording this right at all (migraine coming, vocabulary and composition slowly becoming stunted). One thing I WILL say is that in designing a totally new train and restraint system, I would imagine that there would be some kinks for any coaster designer. Of course, then we go back to B&M, who just released their winged coasters with no issues. So I don't know. I feel Intamin is much more imaginative with their ideas, but they lose something in translation from imagination to reality.

It would be really cool if B&M would buy out Intamin but keep the design team on staff and work with them...coasters would be just SICK then. But still comfy and smooth. Lol I do wish Intamin would get it together because they would be on the right track to world coaster domination, but it just ain't happening with all these mistakes and redesigns.

The suggestion of a slower ride seems a bit premature before we see what Hershey is going to do re: new restraints. The ride is so remarkable because of its speed. It's not obvious that the ride has to be slowed down to make it less "painful."

Also, it's not obvious that only "fun" ought to that which ride designers try to maximize. Indeed, we (or at least I) want coasters to be "thrilling," by which I mean I want coasters to produce "nervous tremors of excitement and fear." There aren't too many coasters that actually incite fear, but it seems like Skyrush achieves this.

Though I thought Robb Alvey's general response to this criticism (e.g., "American riders are lame; let's just let Intamin build the best and intense coasters in Europe") was a bit intense and perhaps inappropriate given that he apparently hasn't ridden it yet, I'm starting to agree with him on this. This is one of the few very intense coasters we have in the US. Though I might wish for it to be slightly more comfortable, the ride as-is is the most interesting in the park, perhaps even on the east coast. For instance, Nitro, Kingda Ka, and maybe even Bizarro at SFNE feel like kiddie coasters in comparison.

Still haven't seen anyone complain about the intensity. Everyone seems to be complaining about the comfort.

Big difference.

cdude3 said:

The suggestion of a slower ride seems a bit premature before we see what Hershey is going to do re: new restraints. The ride is so remarkable because of its speed. It's not obvious that the ride has to be slowed down to make it less "painful."

For the record, I'd rather see them try fixing the lap bars before trimming, as opposed to doing both at the same time. Isolate variables, scientific method, etc.

I personally ride coasters for fun. Just to clarify, I'm not sure Skyrush is any more fear inciting than other coasters, just more uncomfortable. Different strokes, for sure. It seems like plenty of other people think it's awesome.

matt. said:

Cue our second ride, about 5PM. The queue was about half-full. This is purely anecdotal evidence but I'm already starting to wonder the popularity of this ride when, for most of the day, it didn't really seem to be packing people into the entrance, and that's even with the horrible dispatch times caused by the station design.

I'm glad you mentioned this. I was going to comment on the earlier post made by someone else about the short queue later in the day, but refrained. When I visited the park the second time, I had a similar experience. Packed queue in the morning, not so much later in the day.

We joked that it was because no one wanted to endure a re-ride. Is it possible that there's some truth to that? Perhaps.

Gonch: People on this forum have suggested slowing down the ride, thus making it not more, and probably less intense.

Yes, they suggested it as a fix for the pain the ride causes. As a solution for a comfort issue, not an intensity issue.

No one here has complained that the ride is too intense, they're complaining that it hurts to ride.

I am all for restraint adjustments before doing trims on the ride. I'm not interested in seeing Skyrush neutered. However, I am having trouble thinking of any restraint system that would safely hold riders in the train, as Skyrush is seriously that intense. Every airtime hill is like El Toro's surprise final airtime hill, but on steroids. I don't WANT the speed taken down a notch, but I do wonder if it is possible to comfortably restrain riders and still keep them safe. Skyrush is THAT intense. I think I would have absolutely loved it if it hadn't been so damn painful. I don't think I have experienced or ever will experience again that amount and strength of ejector air.

But yes, the point of all of this is that I would like to see changes made for discomfort, NOT intensity.

I'm sure there are a whole bunch of lap bar restraint systems that will safely and comfortably hold riders in the that train. It's just that Intamin didn't design one.

Gonch-

I think I've been pretty clear, but perhaps not.

Suppose that intensity is strictly increasing in speed. Now note that some have suggested slowing down the ride, as you note, to reduce pain (not explicitly because Skyrush is too intense). But we agreed that intensity is reduced when speed is reduced. So since reducing speed is a sufficient condition for reduction in intensity, by implication people have suggested decreasing intensity of the ride.

I'm not interested in intention; I'm interested in outcomes. Reducing speed reduces intensity, and perhaps also pain. I don't want a less intense Skyrush. So, as usual, "good" intentions do not excuse "bad" (by my definition) outcomes.

Fixing the lap bars will probably make it more comfortable.

Slowing down the ride will probably make it more comfortable.

Slowing down the ride will certainly make it less intense.

Overall, I just want the coaster to be enjoyable, and Hershey wants it to be as good an investment as possible. I can for sure give opinions about what it would take to reach the first item, but can only speculate about the other.

Ok. I get it. You're arguing the other side of the same coin. Making the ride more comfortable with speed adjustments would likely reduce the intensity of the ride.

But here's what you originally said:

Indeed, we (or at least I) want coasters to be "thrilling," by which I mean I want coasters to produce "nervous tremors of excitement and fear." There aren't too many coasters that actually incite fear, but it seems like Skyrush achieves this.

Though I thought Robb Alvey's general response to this criticism (e.g., "American riders are lame; let's just let Intamin build the best and intense coasters in Europe") was a bit intense and perhaps inappropriate given that he apparently hasn't ridden it yet, I'm starting to agree with him on this.

No. One. Here. Is. Complaining. That. The. Ride. Is. Too. Intense.

And they're still not, so the Alvey complaint (and the agreement with it) is completely invalid as it pertains to the CBuzz community contributing to this discussion. No one here thinks the ride is too intense. Many think it is too painful.

In an effort to reduce the pain, one suggestion being tossed about has been to trim the ride, which - as you said - would also reduce the forces making the ride less 'intense' in the process.

But none of that has to do with the fact that no one here has complained that the ride is too intense to begin with.

I get where you're coming from, but the residual effect of trimming for comfort wasn't the original comment. The original comment was that American riders are lame because they can't handle the intensity. And that's what prompted my response.

If you want to debate the value in trading intensity for comfort that's a whole different discussion and Matt hit it pretty good and simply in the post above mine.

I am looking forward to riding Skyrush to find out for myself how the airtime feels. I love intense airtime! I can ride ejector seat on Magnum all day without any issues. So, I'm guessing I shouldn't have any problems with Skyrush. There aren't many coasters out there with the kind of airtime. I haven't been on El Toro yet. But Voyage comes to mind and also Expedition GeForce along with a couple of Supermans.

CoffinBoy, I hope you enjoy it. It is not a bad little coaster by any means. The restraints just suck in a way that Magnum has only slightly prepared you for. You will definitely not be disappointed on airtime moments.

I think the lap bar re-design is an easy fix for the park and will probably happen on the off season. But even with more comfortable restraints, it will be interesting to see if people can then handle multiple rides on this.

I'm guessing the park will design an "in house" fix for the ride AND slow the ride down just a bit, but not enough to kill the intensity. That would defeat the purpose of why they choose such an intense design in the first place as it is the ride's selling point.

All the talks of intensity keeps bring one coaster back to my mind - Voyage.

Definitely the most overall intense coaster I've experienced - almost to a fault. I enjoy the ride...once or twice...and after that I wish bad things upon it.

Luckily, I'm a one or two ride kind of guy. :)

But one thing I can say is that Voyage is not painful or uncomfortable at all. Clearly that aspect of Skyrush is nothing more than poor design. I have no doubt that - assuming the reports are representative of the general consesnsus - something will change.

It takes all kinds of rides, but there's a reason the big cookie cutter B&Ms are so popular and rides like Voyage or Skyrush are few and far between.

(keep in mind I say this as someone who hasn't been to Hershey in 4 years and has no plans to return anytime soon)

We joked that it was because no one wanted to endure a re-ride. Is it possible that there's some truth to that? Perhaps.

I'm glad you mentioned this. I was going to comment on the earlier post made by someone else about the short queue later in the day, but refrained. When I visited the park the second time, I had a similar experience. Packed queue in the morning, not so much later in the day.

That's certainly possible, although I would have expected to hear some complaining with as many rides as we got on it. We personally thought the restraints were snug, but nothing unbearable.

CoffinBoy said:

I can ride ejector seat on Magnum all day without any issues. So, I'm guessing I shouldn't have any problems with Skyrush.

Magnum is still my all-time favorite steel coaster (yeah, I'm one of those types). The airtime on Magnum is not comparable to the airtime on Skyrush.

Funny Voyage is being brought up...I love the ride but I prefer to ride it on occasion, and with breaks in between. I do agree that both Voyage and Skyrush are "intense" but in wildly different ways. Voyage to me is more about raw physicality multiplied by the insane length of the ride. Skyrush (and this is disregarding my discomfort) has a sustained, relentless speed I've never seen on another coaster. The experience is brief, and I suspect for most riders, a complete blur. Like a short explosion of complete sensory overload.

matt. said:

Magnum is still my all-time favorite steel coaster (yeah, I'm one of those types). The airtime on Magnum is not comparable to the airtime on Skyrush.

Funny Voyage is being brought up...I love the ride but I prefer to ride it on occasion, and with breaks in between. I do agree that both Voyage and Skyrush are "intense" but in wildly different ways. Voyage to me is more about raw physicality multiplied by the insane length of the ride. Skyrush (and this is disregarding my discomfort) has a sustained, relentless speed I've never seen on another coaster. The experience is brief, and I suspect for most riders, a complete blur. Like a short explosion of complete sensory overload.

I'm actually slightly scared to ride the Voyage just because I have never ridden such a long roller coaster, especially not a wooden one. I don't know how I'll hold up, and that WILL be because of the intensity.

Matt, you hit the nail on the head with the feelings of Skyrush. The park really crammed an explosive ride in a small area. If one can put the pain aside enough to give an objective viewpoint, I think Skyrush is one of those rides where you almost have NO idea what just happened except that it was super fast, filled with (arguably) the most insane airtime on the planet, and it whipped you over the top of the lift hill so fast that you didn't even realize there WAS a lift hill. I'm sad it is so short, but until the restraints get fixed, I will probably be relieved every time I ride it. I'm still not giving up on it as a ride and am even losing weight just in case it feels better riding Skyrush with thinner legs.

For what it's worth, I have tiny legs and also found the ride unenjoyable.