Does Paramount have some kind of beef with B&M?

Honestly, yes! And I didnt anticipate that at all. NITRO has a *slightly* more interesting layout, but it suffers from a sort of 'elephantitus'. IMO, everything on that ride just seemed *too big*. Part of that is just B&M being B&M, but it was really noticible (even distracting) to me on NITRO. Apollo, OTOH, had the most airtime of any coaster I've been on, and while not an 'airtime whore', I appreciated that. PLUS, Apollo had the best first drop out of the three. I dunno, I just liked it more...
jeremy
--who incidentally rode Apollo AFTER NITRO

I could not agree more Jeremy.

Apollo is easily the best of the three in my book.  Nitro is second and Bull third.

The suggestion that Nitro is just too B&M big is a good one.  Although fun, it's drops seem a little too calculated and drawn out, not surprising like AC.

AC ranks as my 2nd fav steel, behind Superman: ROS at SFNE.  SROS @ SFNE is the most supreme work of steel coaster engineering I have ever ridden.  IMO is is about as near to perfection as I can find.

Shaggy

DWeaver said:
Ahh, but how great it is to have the no-nosense posts of Ravenguy98 back again! 

 

1.  Word to you!

 

2.  I thought Nitro was much better than RB.  I really need to get down and ride Apollo.  The thing about all of these rides is that obviously they are finnicky.  I've had some seriously sluggish rides on RB, and then i've had some night rides on RB that nearly kicked the pants of MF, if you ask me. 

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Fighting for peace is like screwing for virginity.

I'm coming late into this thread, but I think Shaggy has the real key, WAAAAY back up there at the top of the page.

When Kings Island installed King Cobra, the B&M stand-up coaster was not an option. So they ended up with a Togo Astro-Comet. When Vortex was built, the B&M sit-down looper was not an option, and they went with Arrow. The story is repeated time and again: Paramount's parks have coasters that are groundbreaking creations. PGA has Stealth instead of AIR because Stealth was ready to go. About the only coaster genre where Paramount didn't build someone else's coaster before B&M came up with a version is with the inverted coaster. And you know, without a single B&M coaster, Kings Island still has more overhead track coasters than any other park.

To put it another way, you can't buy a PT Cruiser from Cadillac. :)

--Dave Althoff, Jr.

Funny how these threads go around (sort of like a REAL conversation, LOL).  Yes, I am sure that RideMan and Shaggy are correct in that B&M doesn't really do anything new and groundbreaking, they take an existing design and make it better (sometimes MUCH better).  Maybe they're related to BASF - if you've seen the commercial, you know what I mean.  Inverted, Stand-ups - B&M wins hands-down IMO.  As fat as floorless is concerned, BKF was the best, but I don't see much difference between a floorless and a standard sit-down.  As far as hypers - I'll go with Intamin...even though MF wasn't my personal fav, the speed and raw power of MF is undeniable, and when you add the airtime of S:RoS....GO with Intamin!    (What was wrong w/ my AC rides...guess I'll have to go back sometime...;~)!!!
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the buzzer formerly known as gatorwoodie
Son of Drop Zone - PKI CoasterCamp I Champions!!!

B&M was the first with the inverted though. Yes, they do seem to be design enhancers and improvers. Like Standups, sit-downs, etc... Oh the Hulk did make the Discovery top 10, but maybe that does not count for us here. I find myself agreeing with 2Hostyl on a lot of posts here. Though I have not ridden Nitro or AC yet. And if there was some dispute between Paramount and B&M, no way it would be kept quiet, everyone would know because all the other park companies would want to take advantage of a dispute between a competitor and a mutual supplier.

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Any resemblance to living or
dead people is purely coincidental.

I wonder if price may have something to do with it as well...I would imagine that new concept rides are cheaper...a tradeoff for potential problems?

If it is strictly marketing, I find it interesting that the philosophy didn't change when KECO handed the parks off to Paramount. Perhaps the upper management remained intact?

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"I'll bet that thing hits 5 Gs going through that loop.....faaar ooouut!"

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skysox said:
"Oh the Hulk did make the Discovery top 10, but maybe that does not count for us here. I find myself agreeing with 2Hostyl on a lot of posts here. "

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Good point, I had forgotten about The Incredible Hulk Coaster. Funny, I dont remember that particular show (maybe, I'm letting my personal bias get in the way :)).

Oh, and nobody is allowed to agree with 2Hostyl. It's in the FAQ ;)
jeremy --really full of himself today

I can't believe that no one has brought up the fact the Marriott owned both Great Americas when the two first B&M's were built. I am not sure who owned Carowinds when their Vortex was built but I suspect that it wasn't Paramount, since when Paramount bought parks they began theming rides after Paramount movies, at least at first. Someone at Marriott should be congratulated for trying out B&M coasters, especially because they were, and still are very expensive. Plus I believe they were quite scary to the GP at first, since stand-up coasters were very new(weren't you a little nervous the first time you rode a stand-up? especially a Togo?) I bet that the first inverts (Batman and Top Gun) were probably contracted to be built when Paramount bought the parks, and they changed the theme to fit their movies.

-djansi

"Eject Goose, eject!"

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djansi said:
I can't believe that no one has brought up the fact the Marriott owned both Great Americas when the two first B&M's were built. I am not sure who owned Carowinds when their Vortex was built but I suspect that it wasn't Paramount, since when Paramount bought parks they began theming rides after Paramount movies, at least at first. Someone at Marriott should be congratulated for trying out B&M coasters, especially because they were, and still are very expensive. Plus I believe they were quite scary to the GP at first, since stand-up coasters were very new(weren't you a little nervous the first time you rode a stand-up? especially a Togo?) I bet that the first inverts (Batman and Top Gun) were probably contracted to be built when Paramount bought the parks, and they changed the theme to fit their movies.

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Ok, here's a bit about Paramount Parks' history:
Both Great Americas were owned by Marriotts, correct. Then Six Flags bought the Illinois one; Kings Entertainment were hired by the city (AFAIK, prove me wrong if you find accurate sources that says otherwise) to manage the Californian Great America (c. 1980s). Kings Entertainment then bought (I think, CW could have been already a part of KECO) Canada's Wonderland, then Carowinds.
Now all five current North American Paramount Parks are handled by KECO.
KECO then contracted with Bolliger & Mabillard for the two Vortexes. I believe Carowinds became Paramount in 1993.
That was off the top of my head. I'll check with reliable sources later to confirm.

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The Jet Coaster ROARS!
Will Johansson, Webmaster of Xtreme Paramount Parks
http://xpp.coasterbuzz.com/

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2Hostyl said:

Good point, I had forgotten about The Incredible Hulk Coaster. Funny, I dont remember that particular show (maybe, I'm letting my personal bias get in the way ).

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Well you can't remember that show, cause it hasn't aired yet!  It airs in May 2002 AFAIK, they did some taping at CP towards the end of the season for it (Trust me on that, had to come in to work MF at 6 am for two days in a row).  Had some local kid doing the commentary for MF, I think he's the kid of some newscaster or something.

The guys doing the taping said that Hulk was #1, as a matter of fact.

-Natalie
Who's STILL getting owned by the formatting, after all this time.

*** This post was edited by AirtimeSROS on 11/9/2001. ***

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The Jet Coaster said:

Ok, here's a bit about Paramount Parks' history:
Kings Entertainment then bought (I think, CW could have been already a part of KECO) Canada's Wonderland, then Carowinds.
Now all five current North American Paramount Parks are handled by KECO.
KECO then contracted with Bolliger & Mabillard for the two Vortexes. I believe Carowinds became Paramount in 1993.
That was off the top of my head. I'll check with reliable sources later to confirm.

By the late 1980's the parks once owned and operated under the KECO/Taft title were being run by Carl Linder.  Carl Linder basically IS Cincinnati.  P&G, General Mills etc etc etc.
Taft Productions had long gone defunct and he had bought out the Lion's share of interest.
Canada's Wonderland was not purchased by KECO.  it was an original park developed, paid for and brought to life by KECO/Taft.
All the parks that fell under Mr. Linder's company by the early 1990's were the ones currently labled Paramount Parks.  Each of those parks received the prefix "Paramount" when Paramount Communications bought controlling interest from Mr. Linder in late 1992.  The moniker arrived on the front of each park's name beginning in the 1993 season.  Mr. Linder is still a shareholder, but by no means has controlling interest any longer.  Paramount Communications was gobbled up by megaconglomerate Viacom, who currently retains the "Paramount" division.
Shaggy

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