Mother and daughter freak-out on Kennywood's Pitt Fall

Wow...the compassion around here continues to impresses me.

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A random Mooshter's Dawntionary listing: Lymph [v.] to walk with a lisp.

Come on, Moosh. She's GP ... she's automatically stupid and deserves what's coming to her!

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Walt Schmidt - Virtual Midway
*** This post was edited by Gemini 7/9/2003 5:28:40 PM ***

Okay, here's the thing: I talked to the people operating the ride after this happened. Not because I heard of any incident, and well before it was in the news. Just small talk.

With no reason to lie or hide anything (because a case hadn't been made of it yet) I was told that there was a kid riding the ride whose mother freaked out after the ride was already in motion. I was told that when the ride re-arrived at the station, the child was calm as when they left, and the mother was still freaking out.

This incident was caused by the parent. Period. The mom going nuts surely led to the child being scared later.

To stop the ride mid-cycle would mean having all four cars suspended about 100 feet in the air until they could be brought down in the (painfully s-l-o-w) manual mode. What's more scary if you don't like heights? Hanging there until someone lets you down, or completing the ride cycle?

And lastly, do you know how many times per day people yell "I'm scared" or "let me off I changed my mind"? People yell all sorts of stuff on thrill rides. If parks stopped a ride every time a passenger said they were scared then no one would EVER get to ride. If the operator would've seen a serious safety issue, of course the ride would be stopped. In this case, though, it's just someone who was scared that didn't feel she got her ass kissed enough afterwards.

I'd feel sorry for the kid if she was truly terrified, but by all witnesses' accounts, that most certainly was not the case.

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Come on, fhqwgads!

It seems, as Jim Fisher has said, the only mistake made was by the child by unfastening the restraint. If I'm the parent, I'm more angry with my child for putting herself in apparent danger.

I think she's mad at the wrong person, trying to blame the park for her child's misjudgement.

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Without the chaindog, you'd never get up the lifthill...

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To stop the ride mid-cycle would mean having all four cars suspended about 100 feet in the air until they could be brought down in the (painfully s-l-o-w) manual mode. What's more scary if you don't like heights? Hanging there until someone lets you down, or completing the ride cycle?

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Interesting you should bring that up. I've never coped well with drop rides. However, I force myself on to them from time to time in an attempt to beat my fear. Heights do not bother me one bit -- the tense wait at the top wondering when the drop will come is what gets me. This is the same reason that Oblivion at Alton Towers is the only Roller Coaster which has phased me in a few years, entirely because of the holding brake and the "don't look down" recording.

When I rode Drop Zone at Kings Island recently, I became extremely tense at the top. Indeed after the ride cycle had completed it took me ten minutes to stop shaking. I don't know for sure, but I suspect I could have relaxed immediately if the ride was being lowered manually.

Regards,
Richard

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http://www.bannister.org/coasters/

ZBeeble, Pittfall is an Intamin Giant Drop and doesn't use hydralics to lift the ride compartments. I'm not familiar with the operation of the ride, but from working other rides at the park, the ride motion startip is most likely instanteous. If something happens after pressing the button(s), that is why there is a big, red E-stop button.

I'm sure other ops here have come across pushy parents who force their child to ride when its clear they don't want to.

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2002/2003
KWTM

Look, yes this was clearly a case of overreation, and yes, the melodrama could have been avoided. But lets step back a minute here.

You are a guest at Kennywood, who has never really been all that interested in how a ride work (I know, I know...kinda a departure from our normal frame of mind). You get into the Pitt Fall, a fairly intimidating ride, with your 10 year old daughter, who is the apple of your eye. And you see her start to get nervous, and unfasten her seatbelt. Couple this with perhaps seeing the ops refuse to allow a oversized person to ride earlier because they could not fasten the seatbelt. Now, in this situation, what conclusion would you draw? Personally, mine would have been somewhat similar to the woman's. How was she to know, without being told, that the harnesses locked in place without the seatbelt being latched. Seriously, the instinct to protect one's children is probably one of the strongest instincts in the human psyche, especially from threats beyond one's ken.

Maybe everyone should step back from their general dislike for the "GP" and look at things from the perspective of a non-enthusiast.

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And Trogdor smote the Kerrek, and all was laid to Burnination.
-Strong Bad

The Intamin drop towers start instantaneously, except for the bigger Drop Zones at PKI and PKD. There is a button in each section to lock the car on that side of the tower. Perhaps as the article said, it was too late to stop the ride. I remember seeing a show featuring John Wardley (sp?), talking about the design of Nemesis. He said they try to make sure that parts of the ride are exposed, so as to weed riders out of line who may get scared, and hence slowdown ride capacity. It doesn't get more exposed than Pittfall. If seeing the tower while driving up the hill doesn't scare you, than watching the thing in action should. Drop towers are nothing to play around with from a fear perspective. If you saw the Discovery/TLC program (can't remember which) were they placed heartrate monitors on passengers while ascending to the top of Pittfall, you know that the heart rates were shooting through the roof.
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If you have a problem with clones, the solution is real simple—Stop traveling.

I was told that the seatbelts are only to make sure you fit correctly in the seat and has nothing to do with holding you in. If the belt buckles then you fit and the seats are designed so you cant fall out. So if that is right, there was no reason to stop the ride. And I agree, on the way up the girl had more than enough time to buckle it.

The Intamin drop towers start instantaneously, except for the bigger Drop Zones at PKI and PKD

Pitt Fall does use the same locking method as the Drop Zones.

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http://coasterplace.web1000.com
*** This post was edited by Code823 7/10/2003 12:45:29 AM ***

What gets me is if the girl was scared, what the hell was she accomplishing by unbuckling her seatbelt?!

I have worked an Intamin Giant Drop, so let me clear some things up. Yes, there is a panel for each car, but these only have 'dispatch ok' buttons, 'restraint open' buttons, and an Emergency Stop. Each 'dispatch ok' button must be pushed prior to dispatching the ride. To dispatch the ride, the operator must simultaneously press two buttons on the panel. After these are pushed and held down, there is a two or three second delay before the lift engages. It is very possible that the ride had been already dispatched when the woman requested she be let off. The operators options at this point were to 1.) Emergency stop the ride, which would only leave the people stuck on the ride until it could be reset, or 2) allow the ride to continue in its normal operation.

In all honesty, if one of the seatbelts was up, I would have emergency stopped the ride. Yes, they are for backup only, but I would rather stop the ride and wait for it to be reset than to dispatch the ride with what is in all respects an open restraint.

I hope that this has cleared things up, in respect to the operation of the ride.

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"Every day is a bad day on Hollywood and Vine!"

IMHO, the ride should have been E-stopped if was unbuckled. Does anyone know why those seatbelts are there in the first place?? (I'm going to steal Althoff's thunder on this one :) ) Remember back to '99 when the kid fell out of the Giant Drop at PGA. The restraint in that case was secure at dispatch and when the ride finished. The theory is that the kid slipped between the restraint and seat while weightless. A simple belt running between the legs connecting the restraint to seat would have prevented this incident. The belt also serves as a backup.

Since the KW incident involved a kid who removed the belt and knowing why the belts are there, I would have E-stopped the ride. It's always better to be safe than sorry.

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Scott W. Short
scott@midwestcoastercentral.com
http://www.midwestcoastercentral.com

Good point Shivering, but I doubt that the ride op knew about the PGA incident. He probably thought like I do - that belt wasn't there when the ride was installed, so its just extra redundancy, and nothing like that ever happens on my shift ... (not that that's the right way to think, but you have to admit, that's the way 99% of the world thinks ... myself included)

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Formerly PittDesigner (graduating soon!)
Lifelong fan of all Impulses!
--Brett

Everyone keeps saying that the girl had plenty of time to reconnect her seat belt.

A terrified TEN YEAR OLD girl, who most likely isn't a seasoned rider, with a mother freaking next to her, is not going to even THINK of doing that.

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Goccvp1

That's what I wondered about from the start, Scott. If the belt is mandatory, why wasn't the ride stopped? What would happened if I told the ride op that I wanted to ride Pitt Fall without the seat belt? If it isn't that big of a deal, they would let me do that, right?

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Walt Schmidt - Virtual Midway

By the way Scott, thanks for remembering where the incident happened. I couldn't remember in my first post. (third post in)

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Goccvp1
*** This post was edited by Goccvp1 7/10/2003 10:02:03 AM ***

This whole story just makes me irate!! The ignorance of some people just
astounds me. Just as many people have already stated - this is a thrill
ride. "Hello, McFly. Anyone home in there?" This is not the "Happy, Fun
Slide" it is Pitt Fall - the thrill is baked right into the name. If you
are afraid of falling just keep walking right on by. What is more is the
line for this ride is generally long and you have a lot of time to watch
the ride and see what happens to the people on it while you are waiting.
What did they think they were getting themselves into? I don't have all
the facts possibly, but I am beside myself reading this stupidity.

Quote: kpjb 7/9/2003 5:43:50 PM

"With no reason to lie or hide anything (because a case hadn't been made
of it yet) I was told that there was a kid riding the ride whose mother
freaked out after the ride was already in motion. I was told that when the
ride re-arrived at the station, the child was calm as when they left, and
the mother was still freaking out.

This incident was caused by the parent. Period. The mom going nuts surely
led to the child being scared later."

Thank you. It is the responsibility of the parent to look out for the child.
However, I have witnessed too many times of fears that a child only learns
from their parents. How many times have you seen a 3 year old fall on the
pavement and wait and look to their parent's reaction before it starts crying.
Many times if the parent does not react the child won't cry at all, but the
second the child sees the parent overreact and run and scoop up the child -
here come the waterworks.

Quote: keg5651 7/10/2003 12:46:12 AM

"What gets me is if the girl was scared, what the hell was she accomplishing
by unbuckling her seatbelt?!"

If she unbuckled it, why couldn't she just rebuckle it? It isn't that
difficult. Either way when it was unbuckled it should have become crystal
clear at that moment that the belt wasn't what was keeping the harness
down.

Glory of Kilrah said:

"You are a guest at Kennywood, who has never really been all that interested in how a ride work ..."

On a ride like PittFall, even having a basic idea of how the ride works and open seat belt would freak me out.

Cyberdman said:
"If she unbuckled it, why couldn't she just rebuckle it? It isn't that
difficult. Either way when it was unbuckled it should have become crystal clear at that moment that the belt wasn't what was keeping the harness down. "

When I am on a ride that has OTSR's and belts, I sometimes have trouble buckling the belt. The OTSR is down, and the two pieces of the belt buckle are together, but I fumble and can not get them to click together. The main reason is that I am trying to get in and get seated and trying to hurry. I am not paniced, I am not frightened, I am not anything like that... I am just in a hurry to get things secured and get settled. In the case of a child who is paniced, frightened, excited, or what ever, buckling a belt may not be the easiest thing in the world (especially sitting next to a frantic mother).

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Was the ride op in the wrong for not stopping the ride if he saw what was happening? I think so. You wouldn't dispatch a ride with someone not buckled in, so if It was known, it should have been stopped. Should the op stop the ride if a person is simply freaking out? Not sure on that one. I can remember one time at the York Fair (York PA) when my wife and I were riding Pharroh's Fury (swinging ship) and a young girl sitting in the seat in front of us was starting to panic. The op noticed this and brought the ride to the stop so she could get off. He told everyone else to remain seated and after she got off, he started the ride up again. Anyway... so should the ride op have stopped the ride if it was noted the belt was un-done, absolutely. Was the mother in the right to "freak out"? From her point of view, yes. Was it an acutal danger? No, probably not, but she did not know that. If she wanted to complain, complain to the park (and I think she should have complained if the ride was not stopped when a belt was obviously undone). However, where the mother was in the wrong was to go running to the newspapers about this. I think it was blown way out of proportion by doing that. Then again... the newspaper should have also saw this as a "non story" and not done a story on it.*** This post was edited by SLFAKE 7/10/2003 2:00:37 PM ***

OMG thats so pathetic. If she didnt want to ride the freakin thing they shouldnt have gotten in line. This is just rediculous just like the woman that sued PKI about the lightning strike lol.